Metro vs Non Metro

[Proseteye]

23 minutes ago, Perspective said:

ColumbiaHighFan,

I want to offer you a little challenge.   How do you know that schools like Dillard and Northwestern are recruiting?  

I agree with you that it certainly appears that certain schools are getting more than their fair share of transfers.  But, transferring does not necessarily mean recruiting.  Although it could mean that.  

Some schools built up programs and/or prospered at just the right time (relative to the school choice mandates).    I call some of these schools "Field of Dream" schools.   Remember the tagline:  if you build it, they will come?   If you build a successful program, kids naturally want to be a part of it.   Success begets success.   Kids want to play for winning programs/coaches. 

By the same token, programs that are struggling and that want to get to the next level undoubtedly cross over the line and actively recruit (through assistants, 7 on 7, all-star teams, player-to-player, etc.). 

My point is, when you see that a kid like the one mentioned in the tweet you posted has transferred from BTW to NW, how do you know that he was recruited versus the kid just decided he wanted to play with a different/better team and just transferred?  Are you getting insight from inside sources?  Or is it just a gut feeling?

Well, we might say that recruiting is no longer necessary considering that Florida law allows unbridled transferring from anywhere to anywhere for any reason at least among the public schools. Transferring to private schools is still limited by many factors to include high tuition costs and desks available. I think that most of us, that are against unbridled transferring, are against it for moral reasons in that it defeats the objective which is to promote community and family cohesiveness. Otherwise high schools become nothing more than Jr Colleges or farm teams for senior colleges.   

[Perspective]

14 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

I could apply the same logic to the people on here Insinuating that the private schools recruit

Agree 100%.   That's why I stayed away from the public/private debate.   Personally, whether a school is public or private really doesn't have anything to do with 'recruiting' vs. 'just transferring' debate.  

That said, I will say this:  private schools offer a 'value perception' that public schools can't/don't.   The general perception for almost everything in life (and certainly with education and sports) is that if you have to pay for something that you might otherwise be able to get for free, it must be better.  With private schools, it's even more pronounced:  if you can get for free what others are paying lots of money for, it's really, really got to be better.  So, kids who get need or merit-based scholarships (because, remember, private high schools aren't supposed to offer athletic scholarships) and who just happen to be really good at football, get the benefits of the private schools - whatever they may be - without the expense.  Clearly, some private schools have the resources to spend lots of donor money on athletic facilities, which is attractive to kids who play sports. 

But, I'll return to the main topic.  In my view, there are public schools that recruit and public schools that don't recruit.  There are private schools that recruit and private schools that don't recruit.   And for both public and private schools that don't recruit, there are schools that still attracts transfers.    I just think we all need to be careful when we immediately assume that just because one school or another (public or private) gets an abnormal number of transfers, that school must be recruiting.   By the same token, if a school - public or private - is recruiting, then by all means call them out.  Just be prepared to back up your accusations. 

[Perspective]

23 minutes ago, Proseteye said:

All private schools recruit as they are all businesses and to stay in business they have to fill their positions with paying students. Advertising and seeking out paying students is recruiting, whether it is for an academic student only or a student that plays a sport as well. A private school, by virtue of their unique situation, needs to accept as many qualified students as possible no mater where they live or they cannot make a profit nor survive. That being said, private schools are at a disadvantage as many have pretty strict entry qualifications, moral and ethical codes, and most families cannot afford the tuition and/or other requisites. Thus they are limited in recruiting top players that may not meet these requirements.  IMG is a sports training facility that happens to be a high school. Apparently they worked out an agreement with the FHSAA so that they could play under the FHSAA umbrella as long  as no Florida team was forced to play them. At least that seems plausible.

Proset, I understand what you are saying about the private school model.  And I agree with you that, to stay in business, private schools have to advertise and do creative things to attract students.  But if a private school 'targets' an individual because that individual happens to be really good at sports, and proactively encourages that kid to attend the school, that's recruiting and that's against the rules.  Period.  End of discussion.     If you don't think that's what the rules should be, I can understand that (and might even agree with you).   But for now, if a private school recruits a kid because that kid plays sports, that's against the rules. 

[Ray Icaza]

21 minutes ago, Perspective said:

Agree 100%.   That's why I stayed away from the public/private debate.   Personally, whether a school is public or private really doesn't have anything to do with 'recruiting' vs. 'just transferring' debate.  

That said, I will say this:  private schools offer a 'value perception' that public schools can't/don't.   The general perception for almost everything in life (and certainly with education and sports) is that if you have to pay for something that you might otherwise be able to get for free, it must be better.  With private schools, it's even more pronounced:  if you can get for free what others are paying lots of money for, it's really, really got to be better.  So, kids who get need or merit-based scholarships (because, remember, private high schools aren't supposed to offer athletic scholarships) and who just happen to be really good at football, get the benefits of the private schools - whatever they may be - without the expense.  Clearly, some private schools have the resources to spend lots of donor money on athletic facilities, which is attractive to kids who play sports. 

But, I'll return to the main topic.  In my view, there are public schools that recruit and public schools that don't recruit.  There are private schools that recruit and private schools that don't recruit.   And for both public and private schools that don't recruit, there are schools that still attracts transfers.    I just think we all need to be careful when we immediately assume that just because one school or another (public or private) gets an abnormal number of transfers, that school must be recruiting.   By the same token, if a school - public or private - is recruiting, then by all means call them out.  Just be prepared to back up your accusations. 

Perspective, your last paragraph says it all "Some Recruit and Some Don't" so you are readily admitting it happens.  The having to back up accusations is the reason most wiil shy away at naming  names as we aren't sleuths trying to gather evidence.  However being that I am not a big believer in coincidences, although they do happen it does raise suspicions when in need of QB one conveniently shows up.  Have a great QB but need better targets and they conveniently show up;  offensive lineman, no problem.  So it is perfectly normal for one to assume which schools (private or public) routinely break/bend the rules year in and year out without said proof.  Kinda like circumstantial evidence when the pattern just repeats itself.

[Proseteye]

8 minutes ago, Perspective said:

Proset, I understand what you are saying about the private school model.  And I agree with you that, to stay in business, private schools have to advertise and do creative things to attract students.  But if a private school 'targets' an individual because that individual happens to be really good at sports, and proactively encourages that kid to attend the school, that's recruiting and that's against the rules.  Period.  End of discussion.     If you don't think that's what the rules should be, I can understand that (and might even agree with you).   But for now, if a private school recruits a kid because that kid plays sports, that's against the rules. 

I don't think that any private school, including head coaches and ADs, are foolish enough to outwardly recruit. Everything is done through word of mouth or social media mostly by the students themselves. The private schools that have good sports team would not need to recruit anyway as there are many students continually wanting to enroll. The moral/ethical and tuition factors possibly being the only drawbacks. I know that my team, Trinity Catholic, used to have a superb football team. Played in 4 championships and won 2 of them. The reasoning was head Coach Kerwin Bell. So many Players wanted to play for him as he was not only a knowledgeable coach but he built a great team. They accused TC of recruiting because public school players were transferring to TC. Those public school players simply wanted to play for a winning team, a great coach, and get a private school education. Also an ex U of F QB who had connections to the college recruiters. I personally saw top college recruiters at most important TC games.  

[DisabledAccount]

4 hours ago, Ray Icaza said:

Perspective, your last paragraph says it all "Some Recruit and Some Don't" so you are readily admitting it happens.  The having to back up accusations is the reason most wiil shy away at naming  names as we aren't sleuths trying to gather evidence.  However being that I am not a big believer in coincidences, although they do happen it does raise suspicions when in need of QB one conveniently shows up.  Have a great QB but need better targets and they conveniently show up;  offensive lineman, no problem.  So it is perfectly normal for one to assume which schools (private or public) routinely break/bend the rules year in and year out without said proof.  Kinda like circumstantial evidence when the pattern just repeats itself.

Or when a team with a heavy senior core somehow gets multiple kids from 3 different counties to try and compete for a title 

 

The thing is I may not have enough proof to go to the FHSAA on some these teams because I can't get certain sources to reveal the proof but based on what I'm told there are schools who I've accused of recruiting who likely would get busted if the FHSAA opened an investigation into said team

[DisabledAccount]

5 hours ago, Proseteye said:

I don't think that any private school, including head coaches and ADs, are foolish enough to outwardly recruit. Everything is done through word of mouth or social media mostly by the students themselves. The private schools that have good sports team would not need to recruit anyway as there are many students continually wanting to enroll. The moral/ethical and tuition factors possibly being the only drawbacks. I know that my team, Trinity Catholic, used to have a superb football team. Played in 4 championships and won 2 of them. The reasoning was head Coach Kerwin Bell. So many Players wanted to play for him as he was not only a knowledgeable coach but he built a great team. They accused TC of recruiting because public school players were transferring to TC. Those public school players simply wanted to play for a winning team, a great coach, and get a private school education. Also an ex U of F QB who had connections to the college recruiters. I personally saw top college recruiters at most important TC games.  

That is also true of public schools 

 

I know of several schools who had players reaching out to kids to get them to leave school

 

There were even schools from bordering counties trying to snatch Columbia kids in 2020 when It was quoted in the paper that coaches were reading out to our kids to try and get them to leave Columbia

 

I'm very sure that I know one of the schools but because they never revealed names I can't prove it but I'm looking forward to watching Columbia kick that teams ass in the kickoff classic 

[Jesse]

53 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

That is also true of public schools 

 

I know of several schools who had players reaching out to kids to get them to leave school

 

There were even schools from bordering counties trying to snatch Columbia kids in 2020 when It was quoted in the paper that coaches were reading out to our kids to try and get them to leave Columbia

 

I'm very sure that I know one of the schools but because they never revealed names I can't prove it but I'm looking forward to watching Columbia kick that teams ass in the kickoff classic 

Good luck baby brother.  Madison is big brother. 

[DisabledAccount]

4 minutes ago, Jesse said:

Good luck baby brother.  Madison is big brother. 

Columbia has been around longer, has more wins, and leads Madison all time 

 

Sit your ass down jackass

 

This discussion doesn't have anything to do with Madison County anyway 

[s1nglewing]

19 hours ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Columbia has been around longer, has more wins, and leads Madison all time 

 

Sit your ass down jackass

 

This discussion doesn't have anything to do with Madison County anyway 

 

Jesse has nothing to do with Madison County, either.

[DisabledAccount]

1 hour ago, s1nglewing said:

 

Jesse has nothing to do with Madison County, either.

Nope he's just a leach off their success 

[Jesse]

39 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Nope he's just a leach off their 

 

[Jesse]

Just now, Jesse said:

Be quiet 42-28 and 56-10 madison beat Columbia.  

 

[DisabledAccount]

1 hour ago, Jesse said:

 

And you weren't a player on either team so what are you blabbering about 

[DisabledAccount]

And Madison has never beaten Columbia by a score of 56-10 so what the hell did you pull that score out of? Did that game happen in Appleton?

[Jesse]

58 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

And Madison has never beaten Columbia by a score of 56-10 so what the hell did you pull that score out of? Did that game happen in Appleton?

Check maxpreps 2009 season 

[DisabledAccount]

4 minutes ago, Jesse said:

Check maxpreps 2009 season 

Not only was that loss under a different coach who was largely unsuccessful at Columbia that's not even the correct score 

 

See newsflash clown, MaxPreps has a lot of incorrect scores and the scores I have were the ones that were charted by our own historian which was based around newspaper reporting the score who would have actually been at the game while MaxPreps scores can be entered by any random fan from home 

 

But hey I see why you can't hang with anyone in a debate because your trying to use a score from 13 years ago to try and justify some relevance to a current discussion which just shows desperation but we will see who's laughing when Madison comes to Lake City this year because I'm sure of one player who is gonna want serious payback on Madison after you all dragged him back 20 yards to intentionally try to injure him 

 

Btw I saw both Madison middle schools come to Lake City tonight for spring action

 

17-1 win Lake City in softball

15-0 win Lake City in baseball

 

Guess the talent well drying up over in cow town 

[Jesse]

10 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Not only was that loss under a different coach who was largely unsuccessful at Columbia that's not even the correct score 

 

See newsflash clown, MaxPreps has a lot of incorrect scores and the scores I have were the ones that were charted by our own historian which was based around newspaper reporting the score who would have actually been at the game while MaxPreps scores can be entered by any random fan from home 

 

But hey I see why you can't hang with anyone in a debate because your trying to use a score from 13 years ago to try and justify some relevance to a current discussion which just shows desperation but we will see who's laughing when Madison comes to Lake City this year because I'm sure of one player who is gonna want serious payback on Madison after you all dragged him back 20 yards to intentionally try to injure him 

 

Btw I saw both Madison middle schools come to Lake City tonight for spring action

 

17-1 win Lake City in softball

15-0 win Lake City in baseball

 

Guess the talent well drying up over in cow town 

All I like about madison is football.  And Last time madison went to lake city , people were passing out donuts to everyone lol. 12-0

[VeniceIndianFan]

14 minutes ago, Jesse said:

All I like about madison is football.  And Last time madison went to lake city , people were passing out donuts to everyone lol. 12-0

[VeniceIndianFan]

43 minutes ago, Jesse said:

All I like about madison is football.  And Last time madison went to lake city , people were passing out donuts to everyone lol. 12-0

Couldn’t resist with the Homer picture! Lol. “The Simpsons” is the best animated series on television. All other opinions are wrong. 

[DisabledAccount]

56 minutes ago, Jesse said:

All I like about madison is football.  And Last time madison went to lake city , people were passing out donuts to everyone lol. 12-0

A real sports town would strive to be great year round not put all their eggs in one basket 

 

I guess Lake City is just a better sports town then cow town 

[DisabledAccount]

Look at Venice

 

They have sports great all 3 seasons 

 

That fanbase prides itself on tradition year round and being a great program, they don't have one sport that runs for 4 months and has to carry that through mediocre programs in the subsequent months as they dread the gap between the seasons 

[DisabledAccount]

13 minutes ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

Couldn’t resist with the Homer picture! Lol. “The Simpsons” is the best animated series on television. All other opinions are wrong. 

I don't think you even had to explain that but okay lol

 

Even people who haven't watched the Simpsons have probably seen enough Homer memes to be familiar with who that is lol

[VeniceIndianFan]

14 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

I don't think you even had to explain that but okay lol

 

Even people who haven't watched the Simpsons have probably seen enough Homer memes to be familiar with who that is lol

Right, but some people on this board may need explanations more than others. Perhaps fans of a certain school that starts with the letter “M” I won’t name names. 

[Jesse]

27 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Look at Venice

 

They have sports great all 3 seasons 

 

That fanbase prides itself on tradition year round and being a great program, they don't have one sport that runs for 4 months and has to carry that through mediocre programs in the subsequent months as they dread the gap between the seasons 

Venice is a city in Florida. They should like all cites be great at everything