2022 Schedules

[VeniceIndianFan]

21 minutes ago, skyway said:

What kind of recruiting class has Venice lined up for 2022? They lost quite a bit from 2021, and figure to need major additions to have any shot to make a game of it vs. SFA.

We return Keon Sears, Alvin Johnson, Austin Bray, and Jamarice Wilder on offense as well as 2 starters on the offensive line. Our Quarterback will be Michael Valentino who looked excellent as a backup to Brown last season when he saw the field in blowouts. Smooth passer who isn’t entirely mobile but willing to take off for yards when necessary.  

On defense Kintigh and Wahington return but the two edge rushers will need to be replaced. The defensive backfield remains somewhat in tact from last year but the losses of Harris, Weston, and Smith will be felt. They need to replace quite a few starters but I feel that they have the manpower to do it. Time will tell but I think that this year’s Venice team has a decent chance at winning at least one of their games against IMG, or SFA. We will have to wait but I am excited to see what happens.

Go Indians!

[Ray Icaza]

16 hours ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

We return Keon Sears, Alvin Johnson, Austin Bray, and Jamarice Wilder on offense as well as 2 starters on the offensive line. Our Quarterback will be Michael Valentino who looked excellent as a backup to Brown last season when he saw the field in blowouts. Smooth passer who isn’t entirely mobile but willing to take off for yards when necessary.  

On defense Kintigh and Wahington return but the two edge rushers will need to be replaced. The defensive backfield remains somewhat in tact from last year but the losses of Harris, Weston, and Smith will be felt. They need to replace quite a few starters but I feel that they have the manpower to do it. Time will tell but I think that this year’s Venice team has a decent chance at winning at least one of their games against IMG, or SFA. We will have to wait but I am excited to see what happens.

Go Indians!

Actually, Damon Wilson an edge rusher (DE) and possibly your best overall player from last years team returns also.

[skyway]

20 hours ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

We return Keon Sears, Alvin Johnson, Austin Bray, and Jamarice Wilder on offense as well as 2 starters on the offensive line. Our Quarterback will be Michael Valentino who looked excellent as a backup to Brown last season when he saw the field in blowouts. Smooth passer who isn’t entirely mobile but willing to take off for yards when necessary.  

On defense Kintigh and Wahington return but the two edge rushers will need to be replaced. The defensive backfield remains somewhat in tact from last year but the losses of Harris, Weston, and Smith will be felt. They need to replace quite a few starters but I feel that they have the manpower to do it. Time will tell but I think that this year’s Venice team has a decent chance at winning at least one of their games against IMG, or SFA. We will have to wait but I am excited to see what happens.

Go Indians!

Venice will need really good transfers to maintain their 2021 level. Just using returnees and underclassmen will mean they'll take a step back. They'll be good enough to win most all the games either way, but to compete with SFA, IMG etc, they will have to take some of the better players from other schools. Of course, this is not news. And Venice is not unique in this. I'm happy my Dreadnaughts won a tough recruiting battle with Lake Gibson for Ridge's QB. Will we see you guys in May again?

[VeniceIndianFan]

1 hour ago, skyway said:

Venice will need really good transfers to maintain their 2021 level. Just using returnees and underclassmen will mean they'll take a step back. They'll be good enough to win most all the games either way, but to compete with SFA, IMG etc, they will have to take some of the better players from other schools. Of course, this is not news. And Venice is not unique in this. I'm happy my Dreadnaughts won a tough recruiting battle with Lake Gibson for Ridge's QB. Will we see you guys in May again?

I certainly hope to see the Naughts again but I haven’t heard anything about the spring game. Could be another Jamboree like last year but I’m not sure what will happen if the schedule isn’t released soon; infuriating considering that we are already 3 days into April with no real indications yet. 

[Ray Icaza]

2 hours ago, skyway said:

Venice will need really good transfers to maintain their 2021 level. Just using returnees and underclassmen will mean they'll take a step back. They'll be good enough to win most all the games either way, but to compete with SFA, IMG etc, they will have to take some of the better players from other schools. Of course, this is not news. And Venice is not unique in this. I'm happy my Dreadnaughts won a tough recruiting battle with Lake Gibson for Ridge's QB. Will we see you guys in May again?

Transfers that improve any team are a sign of the times.  Some top quality players transfer to play for winning programs and get better exposure.  Other good players that are backups or become backups transfer to other teams for playing time and also some recognition by getting on the field.  This is all understandable and allowed.  However, to openly boast that your school won a recruiting battle for a missing piece (QB) on the offensive side against another rival involved in the same recruiting effort seems to enforce the notion that all top schools cheat.  Then to take it a step further and tell Venice they will have to "TAKE"  some of the better players from other schools clearly violating the rules is not good advice no matter how important winning is.   Maybe some forum members will admire your honesty, all the while giving your program a black eye.

[VeniceIndianFan]

26 minutes ago, Ray Icaza said:

Transfers that improve any team are a sign of the times.  Some top quality players transfer to play for winning programs and get better exposure.  Other good players that are backups or become backups transfer to other teams for playing time and also some recognition by getting on the field.  This is all understandable and allowed.  However, to openly boast that your school won a recruiting battle for a missing piece (QB) on the offensive side against another rival involved in the same recruiting effort seems to enforce the notion that all top schools cheat.  Then to take it a step further and tell Venice they will have to "TAKE"  some of the better players from other schools clearly violating the rules is not good advice no matter how important winning is.   Maybe some forum members will admire your honesty, all the while giving your program a black eye.

I don't like taking kids from other schools but usually we get 3 or 4 a year. We don't have any so far to my knowledge but it is unfortunately bound to happen. Most great programs get some and I'm sure Osceola will get a few as well; a sign that kids want to play for the Kowboys' great program. 

[Ray Icaza]

1 hour ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

I don't like taking kids from other schools but usually we get 3 or 4 a year. We don't have any so far to my knowledge but it is unfortunately bound to happen. Most great programs get some and I'm sure Osceola will get a few as well; a sign that kids want to play for the Kowboys' great program. 

You are correct, Osceola does get transfers almost every year that help the team.  Usually it's a handful, not huge numbers but regardless they add quality and depth.  As I have laid out from our previous year, we also lost a handful to other teams in our area.  Our backup QB became the starter at an 8A school in Orange county and upgraded their offensive passing game while giving himself exposure to the end result of receiving a college scholarship.  We also lost a starter at DE from the 2020 state finalist team who was only a sophomore.  His father envisioned his role at LB and because we were well positioned there we wanted him to continue playing DE.  Therefore the father transferred him to the same 8A school in Orange county and he became their MLB and one of their leading tacklers.  Same year we lost 2 RB's with significant playing experience to Orange county schools as we were transitioning to more passing and didn't need as many RB's; they both became starters for those 2 schools.  These kids and their families made these decisions in what they felt was in their best interest for full participation.  We were OK with that, just like we were OK with the kids we received who also made these choices on their own for their personal reasons.  That is a far cry from recruiting and taking the top players from the surrounding teams by nefarious means as was clearly the case with the admission made on the QB going to the Dreadnaughts. 

[skyway]

5 hours ago, Ray Icaza said:

Transfers that improve any team are a sign of the times.  Some top quality players transfer to play for winning programs and get better exposure.  Other good players that are backups or become backups transfer to other teams for playing time and also some recognition by getting on the field.  This is all understandable and allowed.  However, to openly boast that your school won a recruiting battle for a missing piece (QB) on the offensive side against another rival involved in the same recruiting effort seems to enforce the notion that all top schools cheat.  Then to take it a step further and tell Venice they will have to "TAKE"  some of the better players from other schools clearly violating the rules is not good advice no matter how important winning is.   Maybe some forum members will admire your honesty, all the while giving your program a black eye.

Yes, I do aim to be provocative through unabashed honesty. Whether we speak of the FHSAA or the NCAA, the point remains the same: cowardly "management" by both organizations has created a world in which my post above accurately reflects the truth of the times. And, it's all frequently displayed on what has become THE determining factor in ALL policy, be it sports, state government or that from the White House: Twitter reactions are ALL that matters. Study twitter if you want to know what the Biden, Trump (or insert your favorite politician here) will do. You can view players' Twitter feeds and see mentions of how "such and such school's players showed the love, but I am in a committed relationship with____)". Saint Frances and IMG regularly take the best players from other teams. If Venice is to compete with them, they must do the same. They did as much last year to Sarasota Riverview, deftly stealing both their QB and best skill player (Browne and Haynes). Both Lakeland and Lake Gibson lost their starting QBs and recruited Pleuss from Ridge. Lakeland won that one; LG won the battle for Winter Haven's RB. It is what it is, until somebody grows some testicles and says "enough is enough".

[skyway]

2 hours ago, Ray Icaza said:

You are correct, Osceola does get transfers almost every year that help the team.  Usually it's a handful, not huge numbers but regardless they add quality and depth.  As I have laid out from our previous year, we also lost a handful to other teams in our area.  Our backup QB became the starter at an 8A school in Orange county and upgraded their offensive passing game while giving himself exposure to the end result of receiving a college scholarship.  We also lost a starter at DE from the 2020 state finalist team who was only a sophomore.  His father envisioned his role at LB and because we were well positioned there we wanted him to continue playing DE.  Therefore the father transferred him to the same 8A school in Orange county and he became their MLB and one of their leading tacklers.  Same year we lost 2 RB's with significant playing experience to Orange county schools as we were transitioning to more passing and didn't need as many RB's; they both became starters for those 2 schools.  These kids and their families made these decisions in what they felt was in their best interest for full participation.  We were OK with that, just like we were OK with the kids we received who also made these choices on their own for their personal reasons.  That is a far cry from recruiting and taking the top players from the surrounding teams by nefarious means as was clearly the case with the admission made on the QB going to the Dreadnaughts. 

The *only* difference for Osceola is its relative remote location, further away from other programs. If they were close in to Orange or Polk county, they'd be in the same ball game.

[VeniceIndianFan]

8 hours ago, Ray Icaza said:

You are correct, Osceola does get transfers almost every year that help the team.  Usually it's a handful, not huge numbers but regardless they add quality and depth.  As I have laid out from our previous year, we also lost a handful to other teams in our area.  Our backup QB became the starter at an 8A school in Orange county and upgraded their offensive passing game while giving himself exposure to the end result of receiving a college scholarship.  We also lost a starter at DE from the 2020 state finalist team who was only a sophomore.  His father envisioned his role at LB and because we were well positioned there we wanted him to continue playing DE.  Therefore the father transferred him to the same 8A school in Orange county and he became their MLB and one of their leading tacklers.  Same year we lost 2 RB's with significant playing experience to Orange county schools as we were transitioning to more passing and didn't need as many RB's; they both became starters for those 2 schools.  These kids and their families made these decisions in what they felt was in their best interest for full participation.  We were OK with that, just like we were OK with the kids we received who also made these choices on their own for their personal reasons.  That is a far cry from recruiting and taking the top players from the surrounding teams by nefarious means as was clearly the case with the admission made on the QB going to the Dreadnaughts. 

Wasn’t Riverview's quarterback last year, Will Carter, a transfer from IMG? My father actually knows his parents and there was now way they could hope to pay anything close to what IMG charges annually without some sort of financial aid. If so that would make sense why Browne Transferred, because a 2-QB system helps no one. Neither person likes relinquishing their starting spot to share time and as a result not much work gets done because the offense has to scramble on and off to meet the needs of its Qb.   It’s kind of like the Carolina Panthers’ situation last season; Darnold and Newton shared time and they brought 5 wins to their team after a 3-0 start. Sheesh. 

[Ray Icaza]

6 hours ago, skyway said:

Yes, I do aim to be provocative through unabashed honesty. Whether we speak of the FHSAA or the NCAA, the point remains the same: cowardly "management" by both organizations has created a world in which my post above accurately reflects the truth of the times. And, it's all frequently displayed on what has become THE determining factor in ALL policy, be it sports, state government or that from the White House: Twitter reactions are ALL that matters. Study twitter if you want to know what the Biden, Trump (or insert your favorite politician here) will do. You can view players' Twitter feeds and see mentions of how "such and such school's players showed the love, but I am in a committed relationship with____)". Saint Frances and IMG regularly take the best players from other teams. If Venice is to compete with them, they must do the same. They did as much last year to Sarasota Riverview, deftly stealing both their QB and best skill player (Browne and Haynes). Both Lakeland and Lake Gibson lost their starting QBs and recruited Pleuss from Ridge. Lakeland won that one; LG won the battle for Winter Haven's RB. It is what it is, until somebody grows some testicles and says "enough is enough".

Guess you exposed my stupidity as I never imagined that OHS, Venice, Lakeland (or insert whoever) goal was to beat the likes of IMG, Mater Dei, Saint Frances, Don Bosco, etc... as they recruit nationwide.  So forgive me for believing that rule breaking for that end is unacceptable. 

[Ray Icaza]

45 minutes ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

Wasn’t Riverview's quarterback last year, Will Carter, a transfer from IMG? My father actually knows his parents and there was now way they could hope to pay anything close to what IMG charges annually without some sort of financial aid. If so that would make sense why Browne Transferred, because a 2-QB system helps no one. Neither person likes relinquishing their starting spot to share time and as a result not much work gets done because the offense has to scramble on and off to meet the needs of its Qb.   It’s kind of like the Carolina Panthers’ situation last season; Darnold and Newton shared time and they brought 5 wins to their team after a 3-0 start. Sheesh. 

Actually, Will Carter played for Riverview last year and at least against us in the 2020 playoffs was the most effective of the 2 due to his running ability.  So no, he didn't transfer in from IMG.

[VeniceIndianFan]

14 minutes ago, Ray Icaza said:

Actually, Will Carter played for Riverview last year and at least against us in the 2020 playoffs was the most effective of the 2 due to his running ability.  So no, he didn't transfer in from IMG.

I must be thinking of someone else, then. Thought he was the transfer. He actually played a really solid game against Venice last year in the first half.  A shame they couldn’t at least make the second half as competitive.

[Vaelin]

On 4/2/2022 at 8:44 PM, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

We return Keon Sears, Alvin Johnson, Austin Bray, and Jamarice Wilder on offense as well as 2 starters on the offensive line. Our Quarterback will be Michael Valentino who looked excellent as a backup to Brown last season when he saw the field in blowouts. Smooth passer who isn’t entirely mobile but willing to take off for yards when necessary.  

On defense Kintigh and Wahington return but the two edge rushers will need to be replaced. The defensive backfield remains somewhat in tact from last year but the losses of Harris, Weston, and Smith will be felt. They need to replace quite a few starters but I feel that they have the manpower to do it. Time will tell but I think that this year’s Venice team has a decent chance at winning at least one of their games against IMG, or SFA. We will have to wait but I am excited to see what happens.

Go Indians!

I'm pretty sure Austin Bray is a Senior.  I'm interested to see how the Naples o-line (usually pretty short and quick) fares against the likes of the Venice d-line with two verified studs.  For the first time in a long time Naples has two bona fide D-1 runningbacks (Kendrick Raphael and Isaiah Augustave), which will hopefully offset any oline woes. 

[KeemD321]

Looks like Rockledge is heading next door to the Citrus Bowl to play Jones in their spring game. 

[VeniceIndianFan]

2 minutes ago, KeemD321 said:

Looks like Rockledge is heading next door to the Citrus Bowl to play Jones in their spring game. 

Going to be an awesome game. Wish we could have had a spring jamboree with you guys. 

[KeemD321]

4 hours ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

Going to be an awesome game. Wish we could have had a spring jamboree with you guys. 

That would've been amazing. I know the past couple springs Rockledge was apart of the jamboree Palm Beach Lakes had

[skyway]

13 hours ago, Ray Icaza said:

Guess you exposed my stupidity as I never imagined that OHS, Venice, Lakeland (or insert whoever) goal was to beat the likes of IMG, Mater Dei, Saint Frances, Don Bosco, etc... as they recruit nationwide.  So forgive me for believing that rule breaking for that end is unacceptable. 

I don't think beating SFA etc is a goal for most schools. It looks like it is a goal for Venice (really, John Peacock), as they've now faced both IMG and SFA multiple times.

The "rules" at the moment are such that it's not clear that any are being broken. The kids are the ones chatting each other up at parks, camps and social events. You're not going to be able make and enforce rules prohibiting kids from socializing and saying things like " we really need a QB, you'd start for us!" at some outing in a public park. But, when such things are said, if it piques their attention and they decide to transfer, there's nothing to keep them from doing that. That's how we end up where we are. The only thing that will curtail it is a change in culture, to where all-star team building falls out of popularity, and/or rules requiring transfers to sit a season out if they can't provide proof of residence in the new school's zone.

[VeniceIndianFan]

51 minutes ago, skyway said:

I don't think beating SFA etc is a goal for most schools. It looks like it is a goal for Venice (really, John Peacock), as they've now faced both IMG and SFA multiple times.

The "rules" at the moment are such that it's not clear that any are being broken. The kids are the ones chatting each other up at parks, camps and social events. You're not going to be able make and enforce rules prohibiting kids from socializing and saying things like " we really need a QB, you'd start for us!" at some outing in a public park. But, when such things are said, if it piques their attention and they decide to transfer, there's nothing to keep them from doing that. That's how we end up where we are. The only thing that will curtail it is a change in culture, to where all-star team building falls out of popularity, and/or rules requiring transfers to sit a season out if they can't provide proof of residence in the new school's zone.

Venice doesn’t have to be the overall better team to defeat St. Frances; they just have to be the better team for 2 hours on Friday night when 9/16 rolls around. When Coach Peacock scheduled IMG in 2017 he wanted to beat them to have a chance at the national championship. Unfortunately, in spite of a really hard fought defensive battle they could not get it done. The Ascenders have crushed us twice since then, in 2019 and 2020, including a brutal 49-7 beatdown against SFA in 2019. 

I can assure you that the Indians are not scheduling either game with the expectation of a 21+ point loss. Those kids don’t want to get their butts kicked, they want to win the damn game. We have major unfinished business with both teams. On any given Friday or Sunday anything could happen on the field so the game has to be played. Both IMG and SFA are obviously amazing teams but a few mistakes in the game could mean that Venice brings in a shiny W against a national powerhouse. Just have to wait and see what happens but I think Venice will have a decent chance in either game if they play a strong game and limit their mistakes. 

[Ray Icaza]

13 hours ago, skyway said:

I don't think beating SFA etc is a goal for most schools. It looks like it is a goal for Venice (really, John Peacock), as they've now faced both IMG and SFA multiple times.

The "rules" at the moment are such that it's not clear that any are being broken. The kids are the ones chatting each other up at parks, camps and social events. You're not going to be able make and enforce rules prohibiting kids from socializing and saying things like " we really need a QB, you'd start for us!" at some outing in a public park. But, when such things are said, if it piques their attention and they decide to transfer, there's nothing to keep them from doing that. That's how we end up where we are. The only thing that will curtail it is a change in culture, to where all-star team building falls out of popularity, and/or rules requiring transfers to sit a season out if they can't provide proof of residence in the new school's zone.

We have differing opinions on where to draw the line on poaching players from other teams and I have made my views perfectly clear so no need to elaborate further.  Clearly you have done the same so others looking at this scenario in particular will need to make their judgement on whether a line was crossed or not. 

[VeniceIndianFan]

With that being said, I wish Lakeland would schedule a game against IMG. I think the Dreadnaughts would have a great chance against the Ascenders on a good day!  

[skyway]

12 hours ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

With that being said, I wish Lakeland would schedule a game against IMG. I think the Dreadnaughts would have a great chance against the Ascenders on a good day!  

There's no good reason for them to play IMG. They should stick to playing high schools, specifically those that play by the same sorts of rules they have to play by.

[Perspective]

9 hours ago, skyway said:

There's no good reason for them to play IMG. They should stick to playing high schools, specifically those that play by the same sorts of rules they have to play by.

Hmmm, let's take a closer look at that (by paying homage to David Letterman and his Top Ten lists):

1.  Both LHS and IMG are members of the FHSAA.

2.  Both schools place a greater priority on athletics than academics.

3. Both schools have had tremendous success on the football field.

4. Both schools have won mythical national championships.

5.  Both schools have alums that have had success at the college and even the pro level.

6.  Both schools openly recruit, but are forced to deny it so as not to run afoul of FHSAA rules.   (And for those Lakeland fans that might take offense to this "accusation," please note that I am responding to Skyway, who on this very thread bragged that Lakeland just won the "recruiting battle" for a player from another Polk Co. team). 

7.  Both schools have received assistance from the state legislature that have enabled them to obtain or maintain their success.

8.  Both schools have a head football coach with the first name of "Bill"  (Castle/Miller)

9.  Both schools are located in central Florida, not south Florida.

10.  Finally, both teams have crappy mascots (Dreadnaughts/Ascenders).

I guess what I'm saying is that the schools seem pretty similar to me . . . how, exactly, are they playing by different rules? 

[VeniceIndianFan]

10 hours ago, skyway said:

There's no good reason for them to play IMG. They should stick to playing high schools, specifically those that play by the same sorts of rules they have to play by.

IMG have lost to public schools before (Naples, Columbia,) and Miami Central nearly had them in 2017. Lakeland could easily hang with the Ascenders and maybe even pull the victory on a good day. You say there’s no good reason to play them; don’t you want your Naughts to have a chance at a national championship? 

[Ray Icaza]

3 hours ago, VeniceIndiansFootball said:

IMG have lost to public schools before (Naples, Columbia,) and Miami Central nearly had them in 2017. Lakeland could easily hang with the Ascenders and maybe even pull the victory on a good day. You say there’s no good reason to play them; don’t you want your Naughts to have a chance at a national championship? 

Who really believes any HS football team to be a mythical national champion without having to participate in a playoff format that is won or lost on the field and not on paper.