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Metro/Suburban question


Nulli Secundus

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I don't sit on the board or have any type of influence or affiliation with the FHSAA whatsoever.  However, a major question just popped into my head and I'm shocked it didn't hit me sooner.  With this plan's inception, what made the FHSAA decide to choose county population and subsequently county density as the determining factor for school placement within the select classes?  Why wasn't the actual high school population figures per county used instead?

 

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9 hours ago, Nulli Secundus said:

I don't sit on the board or have any type of influence or affiliation with the FHSAA whatsoever.  However, a major question just popped into my head and I'm shocked it didn't hit me sooner.  With this plan's inception, what made the FHSAA decide to choose county population and subsequently county density as the determining factor for school placement within the select classes?  Why wasn't the actual high school population figures per county used instead?

 

Probably because that would seem to make the most sense.:D

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I don't know that I can answer that question either, since I think you would have to be in the room when those discussions were had.  I have reviewed the minutes (which are pretty sparse) of the 2021 and 2022 Football Advisory Committee, Athletic Directors Advisory Committee, and Board of Directors meetings.  The proposal went from county population in January 2021 to county population density in January 2022, which was eventually approved at the February 2022 BoD meeting.  I know I read somewhere (probably in the newspaper) that the number of high school age students in each county was discussed as a possible metric, but there is no mention of that discussion in any of the minutes.  But there is an attachment to the February 2022 BoD's meeting that shows the 2020 census count for 15–19 year-olds in each county.  So the data does exist.  Why they didn't consider that approach is anyone's guess.  Which is a long way of saying that Ray Icaza got it right, "Probably because that would seem to make the most sense."

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17 hours ago, Nulli Secundus said:

I don't sit on the board or have any type of influence or affiliation with the FHSAA whatsoever.  However, a major question just popped into my head and I'm shocked it didn't hit me sooner.  With this plan's inception, what made the FHSAA decide to choose county population and subsequently county density as the determining factor for school placement within the select classes?  Why wasn't the actual high school population figures per county used instead?

 

I would go a step further and only count the boys for boys sports and girls only for girls sports. Ohio does that 

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A lot has been said and implied on this site about the motivation of the Board of Directors who voted on this proposal.  To be accurate, these are the "home" counties of the Board members who voted in February 2022:

For (9):

  1. Citrus
  2. St. Johns
  3. Highlands
  4. Okaloosa
  5. Brevard
  6. Leon
  7. Leon
  8. Leon
  9. Palm Beach

Against (7):

  1. Jefferson
  2. Marion
  3. Miami-Dade
  4. Pinellas
  5. Lee
  6. Lee
  7. Palm Beach
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6 hours ago, Floridaatlantic1 said:

My bad. Ok so two for lee and zero for Orlando makes a lot of sense and you wonder why lee was conveniently placed in suburban with bs density rule.  Whole lot of change to help roughly six to ten suburb schools.  I know it’s not going anywhere so it is what it is.  

Lee voted against with both votes. Leon was the big culprit with three voting for. Palm Beach split its vote. 

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6 hours ago, DarterBlue2 said:

Lee voted against with both votes. Leon was the big culprit with three voting for. Palm Beach split its vote. 

The Leon representation is really a function of appointments, and the state capital being in Tallahassee.  They are not elected representatives, so I'm sure there is a conspiracy theory in there somewhere.  For those interested in how the board is determined and the current representatives:  Board of Directors - Florida High School Athletic Association (fhsaa.com)

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2 hours ago, gatorman-uf said:

The better question is why not apply the logic to all team sports rather than just football. In a sport like basketball, one kid changing has a larger impact that one kid changing in football (1 of 5, vs 1 of 22). 

With a few exceptions, football is BY FAR the most popular sport and easily has the largest fanbase and far more visibility.  Unless a school is a powerhouse in any other (stadium/gymnasium filling) sport besides football, general interest wains.

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1 minute ago, gatorman-uf said:

I understand, but if it is the most important sport, shouldn't we have tested this unproven idea on the non-popular sports.

As much as I talk about the promotion/relegation idea, the idea works even better in the other team sports as they rise and fall much quicker. 

I cannot disagree with that and the rules should be consistent across the board.

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4 hours ago, Dr. D said:

Attached is the agenda for today's Football Advisory Committee meeting.  Among the items for discussion are larger districts and adding a FIFTH class to Metro and Suburban.   https://fhsaa.com/documents/2023/1/10//2022_FB_AC_Agenda.pdf?id=3819 

Recommendation: Another class size would give the ability to make it more competitive. Just like the metro and suburban were designed to do.

Adding more classes thins the crowd.  PLEASE make it make sense!  Oh wait!  What the recommendation is really saying that the inflated 89% or whatever figure that the championship figure metro class has won since 2010 has primarily been won by Dade, Broward and Palm Beach and they want more opportunity to run the table because they have more schools.  Why not have 7 metro classes and have S. Fl win 6?

Did the board get their degrees in Underwater Basket Weaving? :D

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4 hours ago, Dr. D said:

Attached is the agenda for today's Football Advisory Committee meeting.  Among the items for discussion are larger districts and adding a FIFTH class to Metro and Suburban.   https://fhsaa.com/documents/2023/1/10//2022_FB_AC_Agenda.pdf?id=3819 

Where did all the metro champions come from this year?  Just when I thought brain capacity couldn't get any lower...  The joke is on me! :D

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31 minutes ago, Nulli Secundus said:

Recommendation: Another class size would give the ability to make it more competitive. Just like the metro and suburban were designed to do.

Adding more classes thins the crowd.  PLEASE make it make sense!  Oh wait!  What the recommendation is really saying that the inflated 89% or whatever figure that the championship figure metro class has won since 2010 has primarily been won by Dade, Broward and Palm Beach and they want more opportunity to run the table because they have more schools.  Why not have 7 metro classes and have S. Fl win 6?

Did the board get their degrees in Underwater Basket Weaving? :D

I guess some of the coaches of the suburban and metro areas do not agree with @Jambun82assessment that Metro and Suburban classes were a success and want even more classes. I love the fact that Florida posters used to raze on New Jersey for having all different "championships" but in reality, that is what Florida wanted all along. 

And again these coaches have a fundamental misunderstanding of what leads to classification competitiveness, and it isn't school size.

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22 minutes ago, gatorman-uf said:

I guess some of the coaches of the suburban and metro areas do not agree with @Jambun82assessment that Metro and Suburban classes were a success and want even more classes. I love the fact that Florida posters used to raze on New Jersey for having all different "championships" but in reality, that is what Florida wanted all along. 

And again these coaches have a fundamental misunderstanding of what leads to classification competitiveness, and it isn't school size.

Right!  Competitive advantage is blown to bits the second a smaller school defeats a larger.  If you want "TRUE" competitive advantage, that should be proven against the entire state, not just pockets.  This whole metro/sub division is a travesty and needs to be undone sooner than later.  Go to one damn class or at least reduce the number of classes.  However, isolating areas of the state from one another based on antiquated metrics that are no longer applicable is just stupid.  

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