Your 2018 6A finalist transfer list

[FL_HS_football]

YOUR 2018 6A Finalist transfer list

ARMWOOD HS

1.)    Dwayne Wells Jr, DB – at Lennard HS prior to transferring to Armwood

2.)    Wayne Dennis Jr ,WR – at Lennard HS prior to transferring to Armwood

3.)    Jalil Core, S – was at PA, Imhotep Charter last year

4.)    Agiye Hall, WR – was at Durant HS last year

5.)    Clyde Pinder Jr, DT – was at East Bay HS last year

6.)    Justin Williams, DE – was at Lennard HS last year

7.)    Cam'Ron Ransom, QB – was at Santa Fe Catholic HS last year

8.)    Greg Pressley, WR – was at Superior Collegiate Academy last year

9.)    Jamal Nash, LB – was at Brandon HS before transferring to Armwood

10.)  Eric Wilson, RB – was at Plant City last year

11.)  James Range, LB – was at Plant City before transferring to Armwood

12.)  Adrian Olivo, K – was at Plant City before transferring to Armwood

13.)  Channing Ratclife-Campbell, RB was at Evans and Wekevia before transferring to Armwood

14.)  Tavaris Thomas, S – was at Brandon HS last season

15.)  Myles Forte, WR – was at Plant City before transferring to Armwood

16.) Asheron Michel, DE – was at Brandon HS last year

17.)  Aamaris Brown, DB – was at East Bay HS before transferring to Armwood

18.)  Malik Nash, T – was at Brandon HS before transferring to Armwood

19.)  Geordie Holcombe, OL – was at Bloomingdale HS before transferring to Armwood

20.)  Jaquell Narine, RB – was at Strawberry Crest HS last season

 

 

Miami Northwestern HS,

 

1.)    Leslie Smith, LB – was at Miami HS and Keys Gate Charter before transferring to NW

2.)    Jacquez Stuart, WR -was at North Miami HS before transferring to NW

3.)    Isaiah Velez, QB – was at North Miami HS before transferring to NW

4.)    Javas Jackson, S & RB – was at Miami Jackson HS before transferring to NW

5.)    Kahlil Brantley, WR & TE – was at Doral Academy High School last season

6.)    Rayquan Berry, RB – was Coral Gables HS before transferring to NW

7.)    Terrence T2 Lewis, LB – was at Miami Washington HS before transferring to NW

8.)    Jacob Baptiste, RB – was at Archbishop McCarthy HS before transferring to NW

9.)    Nathaniel Noel, RB – was at Flanagan HS last season

10.)  Georell Kidd, DL – was at Hallandale Magnet HS before transferring to NW

11.)  Ronald Delancy lll, DB – was at Carol City last season

12.)  Sean Delaughter, WR – was at Mater Academy Charter  HS last season

13.)  Kemani Brown, QB&SR was at Carol City & Hallandale Magnet HS before transferring to NW

14.)  Jarule Harris, LB & DE – was at Hallandale Magnet HS last season

15.)  John Joachin Jr., LB & DE – was at Doral Academy last season

16.) Mario Montes, DB – was at  Mater Academy Charter  HS last season

17.)  Timothy Burns Jr, DB – was at Doral Academy HS last season

18.)  Antwan Massie, DB – was at Miami Washington HS last season

[DarterBlue2]

And that is exactly my point. All of these perennial powers have been loading up with transfers for years with a very few notable exceptions. Yet it is only when a school that does not have a tradition of doing this suddenly gets in the game that Old School gets all bent out of shape. 

Do I support this kind of thing? Absolutely not! However, to ignore it at the traditional powers but beat up on Mandarin who has not participated in this "game" till recently, is a hard pill to swallow.

To be honest, in my opinion Carson Beck is the primary reason Mandarin won a state title this year. He is one of the rare Florida High School QB's who not only has the talent to make an impact immediately at the college level, but who has obviously been prepared to do so via proper coaching and mental preparation. Without him, there is no way Mandarin would have beaten Wekiva. 

And, by the way, had Wekiva made the title game, Columbus would have struggled mightily to put up more than 14 points on the board against them. That may or may not have been enough to win the title. But one thing is certain, it would by no means have been assured. Wekiva would have shut down their running game, and I have a hard time seeing the young Columbus QB having much success against them given the pressure they would have brought to bear on him. 

[peezy28]

If you want to know why Armwood does not show up well to state finals (attendance) its because they have no real local fan base... All the kids are basically commuters. 

[Phfootball9]

21 minutes ago, peezy28 said:

If you want to know why Armwood does not show up well to state finals (attendance) its because they have no real local fan base... All the kids are basically commuters. 

Truer words never spoken.

[OldSchoolLion]

Nice effort.  We probably should be careful looking at the data in a vacuum.  It would be good to know the following as well: 

1. The percentage of football players transferring in each year relative to the total number of kids(non-football) transferring in each year.  Is the answer to number 1 a disproportionate amount?  If so, to what extent?  

2. Does a certain school tend to get a disproportionate amount of total transfers relative to other schools in the county?  If it is a desirable school, it's possible some kids might be coming for that reason instead of or in addition to football. 

3. How many of these kids saw regular playing time?

4. The year each kid transferred.  If a kid transferred in his sophomore year and has been there 3 years, do we "count" that as a negative?

5. How many players are these schools losing each year, ie players transferring out?  How many of those are potential starters?  Were any of these kids "replacements for a player they lost.

Where am I going with this?  There are various reasons a transfer might be coming to a school.  We can't be sure that every player on this list was going for the "wrong" reasons and/or is a key player that is going to make a substantial difference in the overall performance of his new team. 

Many coaches who lost a key player and had another player come knocking on his door probably wouldn't have qualms plugging him in.  That may be the case for one or more of these players.  We all know the kids talk and plan their moves when they know where others are going.  In that sense, some of these moves might be outside the control of the program.  We don't know until we have all of details. 

Bottom line, we can't draw accurate conclusions based simply upon quantity of transfers.          

 

 

 

[FL_HS_football]

OldSchool: No one understands how to interpret data better than I do, it was a major part of what I did in the performance of my job. I used to have saying about data....."The numbers don't lie, we do" and by that what I mean to say with that is that numbers can be manipulated/spin'd to say whatever one wants. I understand that each situation regarding a individual transfer could potentially have its own special circumstance, but as I already pointed out with the Lakeland list I posted ......every single one of those players either started or saw significant playing time Friday night during the state title game. That's good and fine but the sheer number of transfers (because they were in fact starters or getting significant playing minutes), on that list should of lit you up with concern in the same manner you became alarmed about Mandarin.......numbers like that just don't happen as a happen stance anomaly.

Manatee has had over the last few years, receiver groups, similar in talent to what Mandarin had this year......what Manatee has lacked was a QB capable of playing the position to 1/2  the level Mandarin had this year. If you were honest about the big difference this year compared to last year at Mandarin, it would have to be the QB.................without that QB Mandarin doesn't win the state title this year. 

[OldSchoolLion]

1 hour ago, FL_HS_football said:

OldSchool: No one understands how to interpret data better than I do, it was a major part of what I did in the performance of my job. I used to have saying about data....."The numbers don't lie, we do" and by that what I mean to say with that is that numbers can be manipulated/spin'd to say whatever one wants. I understand that each situation regarding a individual transfer could potentially have its own special circumstance, but as I already pointed out with the Lakeland list I posted ......every single one of those players either started or saw significant playing time Friday night during the state title game. That's good and fine but the sheer number of transfers (because they were in fact starters or getting significant playing minutes), on that list should of lit you up with concern in the same manner you became alarmed about Mandarin.......numbers like that just don't happen as a happen stance anomaly.

Manatee has had over the last few years, receiver groups, similar in talent to what Mandarin had this year......what Manatee has lacked was a QB capable of playing the position to 1/2  the level Mandarin had this year. If you were honest about the big difference this year compared to last year at Mandarin, it would have to be the QB.................without that QB Mandarin doesn't win the state title this year. 

From the list you provided, 6 transferred in this season(two, 4-star players, including one who had already played 2 years at Lakeland) and 7 last season(one, 2-star player).  Those are not extraordinary numbers/results for one of the traditional FL powerhouse teams.  The devil is in the detail.   

[OldSchoolLion]

I was surprised to learn that the Venice team that beat St Thomas last year had only four, 3-star players who spent their entire careers at Venice.  I'm sure they got some transfers in, but none of them were rated players. 

[OldSchoolLion]

..concerning Eric Wilson of Armwood.  Looks like part of his motivation for transferring to Armwood was due to his father.  It doesn't appear to be as simple as "Armwood recruited him"

"Wilson was almost destined to wind up at Armwood. His father, Eric Wilson Sr., played for coach Sean Callahan and was a 1995 graduate. He coached "E.J.," as he is known, throughout youth league. Wilson Sr. was the defensive coordinator at Seffner Christian when his son was a freshman.  After a year at Plant City, the Wilsons decided it was time to go to their zoned school, Armwood.  "I went here and that was a big part of it," said Wilson Sr., who is an assistant coach at Armwood and works with the inside linebackers. "I wanted him to be around the upper echelon players. You can only get better by being around players of that caliber."

[181pl]

12 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

..concerning Eric Wilson of Armwood.  Looks like part of his motivation for transferring to Armwood was due to his father.  It doesn't appear to be as simple as "Armwood recruited him"

"Wilson was almost destined to wind up at Armwood. His father, Eric Wilson Sr., played for coach Sean Callahan and was a 1995 graduate. He coached "E.J.," as he is known, throughout youth league. Wilson Sr. was the defensive coordinator at Seffner Christian when his son was a freshman.  After a year at Plant City, the Wilsons decided it was time to go to their zoned school, Armwood.  "I went here and that was a big part of it," said Wilson Sr., who is an assistant coach at Armwood and works with the inside linebackers. "I wanted him to be around the upper echelon players. You can only get better by being around players of that caliber."

The Times always goes out of its way to minimize transfers to Armwood. They mentioned one or two, but not the TWENTY listed above.

[OldSchoolLion]

9 minutes ago, 181pl said:

The Times always goes out of its way to minimize transfers to Armwood. They mentioned one or two, but not the TWENTY listed above.

Not all of those transfers came in one year.  It is not unusual for certain metro schools to get 5-10 transfers in one year.  But without further analysis, we do not know the following, and thus do not have the whole picture.

a. who saw regular playing time

b. who was a rated, impact player

c. how many of these players transferred for legitimate reasons ie parent employment.  one kid came from PA...doubt he is commuting 

d. were there any extenuating circumstances for any of these kids

I'll keep saying it, we cannot simply look at "raw" lists of transfers and get the whole, true picture. Am not defending anyone, just trying to be fair to the programs.  

 

 

[OldSchoolLion]

Here's an example of my previous post.  Jacquel Narine is a junior rb who transferred into Armwood this past season.  He had 10 carries and 1 reception for the entire season...less than 100 yards of total offense and 1 TD.  

Maybe next year he will play more of a role, but he obviously didn't make a significant impact this year.  At the rb position, Armwood would have done just fine had he not transferred. 

Is someone like this really newsworthy?  That's part of the problem.  We hear about all of these transfers and it seems overwhelming, but a number of these transfers are not impact players, at least not in the year they transfer.  

[peezy28]

27 minutes ago, OldSchoolLion said:

Not all of those transfers came in one year.  It is not unusual for certain metro schools to get 5-10 transfers in one year.  But without further analysis, we do not know the following, and thus do not have the whole picture.

a. who saw regular playing time

b. who was a rated, impact player

c. how many of these players transferred for legitimate reasons ie parent employment.  one kid came from PA...doubt he is commuting 

d. were there any extenuating circumstances for any of these kids

I'll keep saying it, we cannot simply look at "raw" lists of transfers and get the whole, true picture. Am not defending anyone, just trying to be fair to the programs.  

 

 

Armwood is on the outskirts of the Metro area tho.  Just saying.

[gwdrum75]

14 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

I was surprised to learn that the Venice team that beat St Thomas last year had only four, 3-star players who spent their entire careers at Venice.  I'm sure they got some transfers in, but none of them were rated players. 

A unique thing about Venice is that, I believe, they are the only High School in Venice. Much easier to keep your own players that way.

One thing that I haven't seen mentioned is the sheer number of high schools there are now in single cities. When Bill Castle took over Lakeland in '76, there were 2 high schools in Lakeland (Lakeland & Kathleen). At that time, Lakeland had a student population of 2613. Since that time, Lake Gibson, George Jenkins & Teneroc were built...and Lakeland Christian and Victory Christian started playing football. All of them ate into Lakeland's student population. So there are now a number of high school football programs in a concentrated area. Honestly, Lakeland is the most 'tradition rich' school in the area. Many (probably most) kids at other schools have parents/grandparents/great-grandparents who played/went to Lakeland. And, they usually want their kid to go there as well. 

You can have kids living within walking distance from each other going to different schools. If they see one school with the chance to win a state championship and get them more exposure to college recruiters.........

 

[OldSchoolLion]

1 hour ago, peezy28 said:

Armwood is on the outskirts of the Metro area tho.  Just saying.

maybe it would have been better for me to say highly populated areas rather than metro...I consider that whole Brandon/Seffner/Valrico/Bloomingdale area to be highly populated, at least relative to many parts of the state

 

[gwdrum75]

14 minutes ago, gwdrum75 said:

A unique thing about Venice is that, I believe, they are the only High School in Venice. Much easier to keep your own players that way.

One thing that I haven't seen mentioned is the sheer number of high schools there are now in single cities. When Bill Castle took over Lakeland in '76, there were 2 high schools in Lakeland (Lakeland & Kathleen). At that time, Lakeland had a student population of 2613. Since that time, Lake Gibson, George Jenkins & Teneroc were built...and Lakeland Christian and Victory Christian started playing football. All of them ate into Lakeland's student population. So there are now a number of high school football programs in a concentrated area. Honestly, Lakeland is the most 'tradition rich' school in the area. Many (probably most) kids at other schools have parents/grandparents/great-grandparents who played/went to Lakeland. And, they usually want their kid to go there as well. 

You can have kids living within walking distance from each other going to different schools. If they see one school with the chance to win a state championship and get them more exposure to college recruiters.........

 

And I will fully admit....although not for football reasons, I moved from Bradenton to Lakeland for my child to attend LHS. Tradition and family history had alot to do with it.

[OldSchoolLion]

...a further breakdown of the Armwood list above.  

• 8 players who transferred in this year started/saw regular playing time, including 3 impact players on offense
• 9 players who transferred in the previous year started/saw regular playing time. 
• Of these 17 players, only one was 3-star or above, but there are a number of juniors, so that may change next year.

So, we have found another team that is along the lines of Chaminade-Madonna, who had 21 players on their team this year who started/saw regular playing time(the only two I have come across so far with these kinds of numbers).  It's hard for me to believe Armwood would have been able to make the state title game without these transfer players, which is very disappointing to learn.  It also raises questions about how well they are grooming talent from within. 

Ironically, this list blows away the impact that transfers had at Cardinal Gibbons.  As some have suggested, some public schools today are getting just as many or more key transfer players as certain private schools.  We also must remember that each case is unique and requires an analysis, such as this, to get the whole picture.  In the case of Lakeland and St Thomas, their transfers did not appear to have nearly the same impact as those at Armwood.  Those teams had ample of talent despite their transfers.

 

Transferred in this past season:

3.)    Jalil Core, S – saw regular playing time; was at PA, Imhotep Charter last year

4.)    Agiye Hall, WR – saw regular playing time, definite impact player

5.)    Clyde Pinder Jr, DT – saw regular playing time

6.)    Justin Williams, 3*DE – saw regular playing time

7.)    Cam'Ron Ransom, QB – starting qb, definite impact player; sophomore this year, so possibly some extenuating circumstances? 

8.)    Greg Pressley, WR – saw regular playing time, significant contributor at rb

10.)  Eric Wilson, RB – saw regular playing time and Armwood's big gainer, definite impact player

14.)  Tavaris Thomas, S – saw regular  playing time

16.) Asheron Michel, DE - no record of playing time this season

20.)  Jaquell Narine, RB - not first string; 90 yards of total offense and 1 TD

 

Transferred in for 2017/2018 season:

1.)    Dwayne Wells Jr, DB – saw regular playing time

2.)    Wayne Dennis Jr ,WR – saw regular playing time; significant contributor on offense

9.)    Jamal Nash, LB – saw regular playing time; brother plays at Armwood

11.)  James Range, LB – saw regular playing time

12.)  Adrian Olivo, K – saw regular playing time; his brother is a long snapper at Armwood, so maybe a family decision to transfer?

13.)  Channing Ratclife-Campbell, RB - saw limited playing time, gained 125 yards and 1 TD on 23 carries 

15.)  Myles Forte, WR – saw regular playing time at WR, backup qb

17.)  Aamaris Brown, DB – saw regular playing time

18.)  Malik Nash, T – saw regular playing time

19.)  Geordie Holcombe, OL – saw regular playing time

[peezy28]

3 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

maybe it would have been better for me to say highly populated areas rather than metro...I consider that whole Brandon/Seffner/Valrico/Bloomingdale area to be highly populated, at least relative to many parts of the state

 

Indeed... and will probably out grow inner city Tampa Pop in the years to come with all the development. 

[OldSchoolLion]

5 minutes ago, peezy28 said:

Indeed... and will probably out grow inner city Tampa Pop in the years to come with all the development. 

First Choice BBQ in Brandon gonna have to expand.  If you never ate there, do yourself a favor.  

 

 

[peezy28]

21 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

First Choice BBQ in Brandon gonna have to expand.  If you never ate there, do yourself a favor.  

 

 

I lived in Brandon/Riverview off 301 and Bloomingdale for about 3 years... So I have had  them quite a few times. 

[DarterBlue2]

On 12/11/2018 at 5:12 PM, FL_HS_football said:

Manatee has had over the last few years, receiver groups, similar in talent to what Mandarin had this year......what Manatee has lacked was a QB capable of playing the position to 1/2  the level Mandarin had this year. If you were honest about the big difference this year compared to last year at Mandarin, it would have to be the QB.................without that QB Mandarin doesn't win the state title this year. 

That is correct, without the QB, Mandarin loses in the third round. Carson Beck is an exceptional QB for the high school level. No, he is not my preferred type of QB as I have always preferred the dual threat type at the high school level. However, this kid does what he does so well, that I would bend over backwards to modify my offense so as to fully utilize his talents if he was on my roster. 

I expect him to excel at the college level if given the opportunity. 

[941football]

On ‎12‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 7:15 PM, OldSchoolLion said:

I was surprised to learn that the Venice team that beat St Thomas last year had only four, 3-star players who spent their entire careers at Venice.  I'm sure they got some transfers in, but none of them were rated players. 

In the 4 years my son played I can only remember 1 kid transfer out of Venice to play somewhere else and he ended up quitting football altogether.

Venice is the only high school in the city but Riverview, Sarasota and Lemon Bay are close enough that you could maker the drive. Even North Port is not that far. 

Venice has things that maybe other high schools don't as far as facilities. When we were looking at colleges I had to take a step back. The weight room at Venice was better than some of the colleges we visited. 

If I remember correctly on that State Champ team 25 of those kids played together in Pop Warner on some of the same teams. Most since they were 5-6-7 yr olds. Venice gets 1 or 2 transfers each year it seems. Not all of them end up being a major contributor.