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LakelandGator

The Agenda Buster

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Lakeland transfers vs Dade County!

Let's look at the "real" numbers from "real" talent. We will exclude bench riders, followers looking for a ring, and most importantly someone's agenda.

Lakeland---2018 and 2019

1. Lloyd Summerall---4 star 2018 team sign with UF

2. Jaharie Martin---0 star 2018 team signed with Montana
3. Chris Howard---0 star 2018 team signed with Central Arkansas
4. Jace Hohenthaner--0 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Dad's job relocated to area, signed with Northern Illinois
5. Willie Lampkin---2 star 2018 and 2019 teams committed to Coastal Carolina
6. Arian Smith---4 star 2019 team
7. Kendall Dennis---4 star 2019 team
8.. Chayil Garnett---3 star 2019 team
9. Khalil Crawford---2 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Family moved here from another state, signed with Navy
 
Miami Central---2018 and 2019
 
1. Henry Gray---4 star 2018 team
2. Amari Daniels---4 star 2018 team
3. Katravis Marsh---3 star 2018 team
4. Deidrick Stanley--3 star 2019 team
5. Josue Ultima---3 star 2019 team
6. Ali Makabu---0 star D2 offers 2019 team
7. Jesus Machado---3 star 2018 team, no longer there
8. Jalen Harrell---4 star, no longer there
9. Jovens Janvier---4 star, no longer there
10. Marc Christie---0 star  4 offers 2019 team
 
Miami Northwestern---2018 and 2019
 
1. Ronald Delancy---3 star 2018 team
2. Leslie Smith---3 star 2018 team  signed with Pitt
3. Terrance Lewis---5 star 2018 team
4. Jaquez Stuart---3 star 2018 team  signed with Toledo
5. Isaiah Velez---3 star 2018   EKU
6. Khalil Brantley--- 3 star committed to UM
7. Nathaniel Noel---3 star
8. Rayquan Berry--- signed with FAU
9. Tim Burns Jr.----3 star 2018 team committed to UM
10. Sean Delaughter---0 star signed with Fort Scott JUCO
11. Georell Kidd---2 star signed with Buffalo
12. Wati Huggins---3 star  2019 team committed to FIU
13. John Joachin----2018 team, transferred in and now is gone. 3 offers
14. Antwan Massie---0 star  3 offers
15. Marcus Fleming---4 star 2019 team
16. Amahri McCray---9 offers 2019 team
 
The moral to this story:
1. Lakeland "recruiting" is JV compared to Dade County.
2. Bill Castle and staff takes good and decent HS players and consistently beat south Fla powers.
 
#AgendaBuster
 
 
 
 
 
 

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4 minutes ago, LakelandGator said:

 

4. Jace Hohenthaner--0 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Dad's job relocated to area, signed with Northern Illinois
 
 

Side note....I talked with Jace's Dad last year. The biggest reason he transferred to Lakeland was the FFA program. He didnt even play much behind Jesse Williams his junior year. 

Like I've said before.....I had a couple of the higher profile transfers tell me that their reason for transferring was going deep in the playoffs and playing tougher competition. They felt playing a 10 game schedule with games against Teneroc and Lake Region was not getting them ready for what they would see in college. And.....they get better coaching at Lakeland. Period. Look at the 0 star players that Lakeland has had over the years that end up being 2-3 star players by the end of the year and getting alot of college interest. 

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20 hours ago, LakelandGator said:

Lakeland transfers vs Dade County!

Let's look at the "real" numbers from "real" talent. We will exclude bench riders, followers looking for a ring, and most importantly someone's agenda.

Lakeland---2018 and 2019

1. Lloyd Summerall---4 star 2018 team sign with UF

2. Jaharie Martin---0 star 2018 team signed with Montana
3. Chris Howard---0 star 2018 team signed with Central Arkansas
4. Jace Hohenthaner--0 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Dad's job relocated to area, signed with Northern Illinois
5. Willie Lampkin---2 star 2018 and 2019 teams committed to Coastal Carolina
6. Arian Smith---4 star 2019 team
7. Kendall Dennis---4 star 2019 team
8.. Chayil Garnett---3 star 2019 team
9. Khalil Crawford---2 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Family moved here from another state, signed with Navy
 
Miami Central---2018 and 2019
 
1. Henry Gray---4 star 2018 team
2. Amari Daniels---4 star 2018 team
3. Katravis Marsh---3 star 2018 team
4. Deidrick Stanley--3 star 2019 team
5. Josue Ultima---3 star 2019 team
6. Ali Makabu---0 star D2 offers 2019 team
7. Jesus Machado---3 star 2018 team, no longer there
8. Jalen Harrell---4 star, no longer there
9. Jovens Janvier---4 star, no longer there
10. Marc Christie---0 star  4 offers 2019 team
 
Miami Northwestern---2018 and 2019
 
1. Ronald Delancy---3 star 2018 team
2. Leslie Smith---3 star 2018 team  signed with Pitt
3. Terrance Lewis---5 star 2018 team
4. Jaquez Stuart---3 star 2018 team  signed with Toledo
5. Isaiah Velez---3 star 2018   EKU
6. Khalil Brantley--- 3 star committed to UM
7. Nathaniel Noel---3 star
8. Rayquan Berry--- signed with FAU
9. Tim Burns Jr.----3 star 2018 team committed to UM
10. Sean Delaughter---0 star signed with Fort Scott JUCO
11. Georell Kidd---2 star signed with Buffalo
12. Wati Huggins---3 star  2019 team committed to FIU
13. John Joachin----2018 team, transferred in and now is gone. 3 offers
14. Antwan Massie---0 star  3 offers
15. Marcus Fleming---4 star 2019 team
16. Amahri McCray---9 offers 2019 team
 
The moral to this story:
1. Lakeland "recruiting" is JV compared to Dade County.
2. Bill Castle and staff takes good and decent HS players and consistently beat south Fla powers.
 
#AgendaBuster
 
 
 
 
 
 

I have always had respect for Lakeland.  Last season I made a thread that demonstrated how the Naughts did not inherit a lot of highly rated transfers to win their state title.  Nor have they this year, really.  It was the sheer number of transfers they got this year that got my attention.  

I have to question what south FL powers Lakeland has beaten of late outside St Thomas.  Some of the south FL teams Lakeland has invited to come play are far from powers.  

I also question how your data proves in no uncertain terms that Miami-Dade teams recruit better than Lakeland.  The number of highly-rated players on those MD teams may simply be a function of the relative numbers of talented players available in Miami-Dade.   There are a lot more 3- and 4-star players floating around Miami-Dade than there are in Polk County simply because MD dwarfs PC in terms of population.  

Let's be real.  If a couple more 4-star players showed up on Lakeland's doorstep this year, would they have been turned away?  As it is, a couple of PC teams were highly impacted (Kathleen and Lake Gibson).  Kathleen lost at least 7 players to Lakeland as best I can tell.  I would challenge that the relative impact of those transfers was as great or greater than the impact on any MD team.  

So, maybe Lakeland's lack of high star power has as much to do with "opportunity" as it does with recruiting efficacy.  My issue nowadays is not recruiting or transfers, per se.  I give everyone the benefit of the doubt concerning recruiting unless I have proof otherwise.  And a coach cannot necessarily control if players want to come play for him.  But a coach can control who plays.  How a coach today can look himself in the mirror and think it is sportsmanlike to win a state title by playing upwards of 20 transfers(some of them in front of kids who have paid their dues).  ....they have their lost their moral compass.

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If it looks like it, and it smells like it, doesn't mean you have to taste it to prove it's a turd. You can call it transfers, seeking opportunities, recruiting, etc, it isn't good for high school football if these teams are allowed to compete for state championships against schools that grow their own talent only to have it stolen away. The FHSAA isn't being a responsible organization with the best interests of high school athletics as a priority. It's kind of like the BS we hear all the time from NCAA with Power 5 and Group of 5 discrimination. Has anyone noticed how many Group of 5 teams have beaten the so-called superior teams of the Power 5 this year?

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16 minutes ago, HornetFan said:

If it looks like it, and it smells like it, doesn't mean you have to taste it to prove it's a turd. You can call it transfers, seeking opportunities, recruiting, etc, it isn't good for high school football if these teams are allowed to compete for state championships against schools that grow their own talent only to have it stolen away. The FHSAA isn't being a responsible organization with the best interests of high school athletics as a priority. It's kind of like the BS we hear all the time from NCAA with Power 5 and Group of 5 discrimination. Has anyone noticed how many Group of 5 teams have beaten the so-called superior teams of the Power 5 this year?

I hear ya.  There are extenuating circumstances with some of these transfers..likely even some that look and smell fishy.  I guess the challenge is to how to define the "fishiness threshold" for a team.  Just because a team gets a couple good transfers and wins a state title doesn't automatically mean they are cheating...at least not in today's world.    

 

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It is funny that Lakeland people are saying that they don't recruit when the entire "High School Free Agency" bill that was introduced by representatives of Polk County was because the FHSAA punished Lakeland for a couple of kids transferring for athletic reasons. And the fact that our state legislature hates public schools.

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2 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

I hear ya.  There are extenuating circumstances with some of these transfers..likely even some that look and smell fishy.  I guess the challenge is to how to define the "fishiness threshold" for a team.  Just because a team gets a couple good transfers and wins a state title doesn't automatically mean they are cheating...at least not in today's world.    

 

You can't be a little pregnant; if you're recruiting, you're cheating.

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4 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

Let's be real.  If a couple more 4-star players showed up on Lakeland's doorstep this year, would they have been turned away?  As it is, a couple of PC teams were highly impacted (Kathleen and Lake Gibson).  Kathleen lost at least 7 players to Lakeland as best I can tell.  I would challenge that the relative impact of those transfers was as great or greater than the impact on any MD team.  

So, maybe Lakeland's lack of high star power has as much to do with "opportunity" as it does with recruiting efficacy.  My issue nowadays is not recruiting or transfers, per se.  I give everyone the benefit of the doubt concerning recruiting unless I have proof otherwise.  And a coach cannot necessarily control if players want to come play for him.  But a coach can control who plays.  How a coach today can look himself in the mirror and think it is sportsmanlike to win a state title by playing upwards of 20 transfers(some of them in front of kids who have paid their dues).  ....they have their lost their moral compass.

Are there any schools we can be sure would turn players away (other than if the school was at capacity and had to turn them away)? 

Coaches can tell kids they have to earn their way and bust their ass just like everyone else. They can tell them nothing is promised, that they have to earn playing time through proving themselves. But, when/if that all has been done, why wouldn't they play the best players? Are you suggesting they should say something along the lines of "look, you've been out here busting your ass just like everyone else, and you've clearly outplayed the others at your position, but, you transfered in, so I can't play you"? That seems ludicrous!

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5 hours ago, skyway said:

Are there any schools we can be sure would turn players away (other than if the school was at capacity and had to turn them away)? 

Coaches can tell kids they have to earn their way and bust their ass just like everyone else. They can tell them nothing is promised, that they have to earn playing time through proving themselves. But, when/if that all has been done, why wouldn't they play the best players? Are you suggesting they should say something along the lines of "look, you've been out here busting your ass just like everyone else, and you've clearly outplayed the others at your position, but, you transfered in, so I can't play you"? That seems ludicrous!

Well then, our whole society must be ludicrous.  It's because of a little thing called loyalty, which sometimes gets in the way of "playing the best players."  All you bosses out there, tomorrow go into your workplace and announce you are demoting and promoting people based strictly on their level of talent, ignoring tenure, and see what anarchy prevails.   And them imagine doing that every year. 

The real world does not work like this crazy little world of transferring we have going on right now.  We have created an expectation in our young people that if you work hard you will "get the job."  Well, we all know it's not that simple.  Maybe that's why we are hearing stories of young people quitting jobs because they haven't been promoted within six months of starting, leaving disappointed.  "Paying your dues" is very much a part of the real world, like it or not

We like to blame the FHSAA for not doing its job, just as some like blaming the government for not doing its job.  As coaches and supervisors, its all about taking personal responsibility for our decisionsOur jobs are not simply to play the best players.  Anyone can do that.  The truly  masterful hs coach knows how to build a team and build character in his players.  And understands how bumping a tenured player for that hot new transfer might be great for the short term, but disastrous for the long term.  How many of you out there would like working for a boss with a track record like that, knowing you might get demoted next year so that energetic young intern can have your job?  

Do I sound crazy?  Maybe so.  But I say with the utmost confidence that some of our FL hs coaching legends of the past would not be waiting on the FHSAA to tell them what they can/should do or not do.  These guys had a moral compass they followed.  They made decisions based on what was the "right thing to do"...not necessarily what everyone else was doing.

 

  

 

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On 9/16/2019 at 6:10 PM, OldSchoolLion said:

 There are a lot more 3- and 4-star players floating around Miami-Dade than there are in Polk County simply because MD dwarfs PC in terms of population.  

 

Total population has ZERO to do with talent "per capita". Hillsborough is twice the size of Polk but it's clear who has the better overall talent and teams.

D1 offers/Star ranked kids as of today I can call off the top of my head:

Lakeland(9), Lake Wales(7), Lalke Gibson(7), Victory Christian(3), Lakeland Christian(3), George Jenkins(3), Kathleen(2), Auburndale(2), Bartow(1), Winter Haven(1), Ridge Community(1). *Kills that Polk County All-Star team agenda*

Bottom line your response(s) just shows my thread hit a sore spot. You will make a long post to single out a team, not in Dade County and not care if your point of view is slanted.

Lakeland and PC as a whole is still a decade behind Dade in transfers. It will take much longer than the last 2 years to catch your guys.

And any real football guru would be smart enough to do research before quoting Max Preps numbers. In other words that "list" of kids you placed on Lakeland's roster is inaccurate.

But here's some news of interest for you. Gulliver Prep's 3-star player Yulkeith Brown make's an "in-season" transfer, and guess where.:rolleyes:

Image

 

https://twitter.com/CountyPolk

 

 

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56 minutes ago, LakelandGator said:

Total population has ZERO to do with talent "per capita". Hillsborough is twice the size of Polk but it's clear who has the better overall talent and teams.

D1 offers/Star ranked kids as of today I can call off the top of my head:

Lakeland(9), Lake Wales(7), Lalke Gibson(6), Victory Christian(3), Lakeland Christian(3), George Jenkins(3), Kathleen(2), Auburndale(2), Bartow(1), Winter Haven(1), Ridge Community(1). *Kills that Polk County All-Star team agenda*

Bottom line your response(s) just shows my thread hit a sore spot. You will make a long post to single out a team, not in Dade County and not care if your point of view is slanted.

Lakeland and PC as a whole is still a decade behind Dade in transfers. It will take much longer than the last 2 years to catch your guys.

And any real football guru would be smart enough to do research before quoting Max Preps numbers. In other words that "list" of kids you placed on Lakeland's roster is inaccurate.

But here's some news of interest for you. Gulliver Prep's 3-star player Yulkeith Brown make's an "in-season" transfer, and guess where.:rolleyes:

Image

 

https://twitter.com/CountyPolk

 

 

How exactly is he gonna play with a in season transfer??

 

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6 hours ago, LakelandGator said:

Total population has ZERO to do with talent "per capita". Hillsborough is twice the size of Polk but it's clear who has the better overall talent and teams.

D1 offers/Star ranked kids as of today I can call off the top of my head:

Lakeland(9), Lake Wales(7), Lalke Gibson(7), Victory Christian(3), Lakeland Christian(3), George Jenkins(3), Kathleen(2), Auburndale(2), Bartow(1), Winter Haven(1), Ridge Community(1). *Kills that Polk County All-Star team agenda*

Bottom line your response(s) just shows my thread hit a sore spot. You will make a long post to single out a team, not in Dade County and not care if your point of view is slanted.

Lakeland and PC as a whole is still a decade behind Dade in transfers. It will take much longer than the last 2 years to catch your guys.

And any real football guru would be smart enough to do research before quoting Max Preps numbers. In other words that "list" of kids you placed on Lakeland's roster is inaccurate.

But here's some news of interest for you. Gulliver Prep's 3-star player Yulkeith Brown make's an "in-season" transfer, and guess where.:rolleyes:

Image

 

https://twitter.com/CountyPolk

 

 

No sore spot to hit.  I am not a Miami-Dade homer and "my guys" are not there.  Just because I challenge your conclusions doesn't mean I pimp south FL or have an axe to grind with Lakeland.  I may not be a football guru, or even have a twitter account, but I am old and wise enough not to think I can know a single thing about someone simply based on comments they make on a hs football forum.  

I have created threads concerning several south FL schools on here in which I discuss the number of transfers they have gotten.  As far as the list of Lakeland players I posted on Aug 27, I made the statement "If any of this is incorrect, please let me know." when I posted the list.  Nobody responded.  

So, please correct  the list I posted and repost so we all can see exactly how many Lakeland players seeing playing time this year transferred in this past season.  

 

 

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On 9/15/2019 at 8:28 PM, LakelandGator said:

Lakeland transfers vs Dade County!

Let's look at the "real" numbers from "real" talent. We will exclude bench riders, followers looking for a ring, and most importantly someone's agenda.

Lakeland---2018 and 2019

1. Lloyd Summerall---4 star 2018 team sign with UF

2. Jaharie Martin---0 star 2018 team signed with Montana
3. Chris Howard---0 star 2018 team signed with Central Arkansas
4. Jace Hohenthaner--0 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Dad's job relocated to area, signed with Northern Illinois
5. Willie Lampkin---2 star 2018 and 2019 teams committed to Coastal Carolina
6. Arian Smith---4 star 2019 team
7. Kendall Dennis---4 star 2019 team
8.. Chayil Garnett---3 star 2019 team
9. Khalil Crawford---2 star 2017 and 2018 teams. Family moved here from another state, signed with Navy
 
Miami Central---2018 and 2019
 
1. Henry Gray---4 star 2018 team
2. Amari Daniels---4 star 2018 team
3. Katravis Marsh---3 star 2018 team
4. Deidrick Stanley--3 star 2019 team
5. Josue Ultima---3 star 2019 team
6. Ali Makabu---0 star D2 offers 2019 team
7. Jesus Machado---3 star 2018 team, no longer there
8. Jalen Harrell---4 star, no longer there
9. Jovens Janvier---4 star, no longer there
10. Marc Christie---0 star  4 offers 2019 team
 
Miami Northwestern---2018 and 2019
 
1. Ronald Delancy---3 star 2018 team
2. Leslie Smith---3 star 2018 team  signed with Pitt
3. Terrance Lewis---5 star 2018 team
4. Jaquez Stuart---3 star 2018 team  signed with Toledo
5. Isaiah Velez---3 star 2018   EKU
6. Khalil Brantley--- 3 star committed to UM
7. Nathaniel Noel---3 star
8. Rayquan Berry--- signed with FAU
9. Tim Burns Jr.----3 star 2018 team committed to UM
10. Sean Delaughter---0 star signed with Fort Scott JUCO
11. Georell Kidd---2 star signed with Buffalo
12. Wati Huggins---3 star  2019 team committed to FIU
13. John Joachin----2018 team, transferred in and now is gone. 3 offers
14. Antwan Massie---0 star  3 offers
15. Marcus Fleming---4 star 2019 team
16. Amahri McCray---9 offers 2019 team
 
The moral to this story:
1. Lakeland "recruiting" is JV compared to Dade County.
2. Bill Castle and staff takes good and decent HS players and consistently beat south Fla powers.
 
#AgendaBuster
 
 
 
 
 
 

Your list excludes people who were or are starters. This is the most inaccurate thing I've seen. You're a joke. Stop trying to defend the undefendable. Again, this is the exact reason nobody respects anything about these programs as of late. 

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Lakeland is a great football team, some say a superteam,  full of nothing but Dreadnaught students and they will win many games.

 If you have a problem, it is with the parents of these students, only they can go through the motions to legitimately transfer their kids, not coaches.

Either prove Lakeland is recruiting or continue howling in the wind accusations, no one really cares either way it seems. 

Transfers are allowed to play sports. There it is! Nothing to defend here since it's within the rules. Don't like it then petition to change the rules. 

Oh and it's not 1984 anymore. Time for some on this board to move ahead with the realities of football 2019. It's never going back to the way it was.  

Next Game : Centennial @ Lakeland                             

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On 9/17/2019 at 4:23 AM, OldSchoolLion said:

Well then, our whole society must be ludicrous.  It's because of a little thing called loyalty, which sometimes gets in the way of "playing the best players."  All you bosses out there, tomorrow go into your workplace and announce you are demoting and promoting people based strictly on their level of talent, ignoring tenure, and see what anarchy prevails.   And them imagine doing that every year. 

The real world does not work like this crazy little world of transferring we have going on right now.  We have created an expectation in our young people that if you work hard you will "get the job."  Well, we all know it's not that simple.  Maybe that's why we are hearing stories of young people quitting jobs because they haven't been promoted within six months of starting, leaving disappointed.  "Paying your dues" is very much a part of the real world, like it or not

We like to blame the FHSAA for not doing its job, just as some like blaming the government for not doing its job.  As coaches and supervisors, its all about taking personal responsibility for our decisionsOur jobs are not simply to play the best players.  Anyone can do that.  The truly  masterful hs coach knows how to build a team and build character in his players.  And understands how bumping a tenured player for that hot new transfer might be great for the short term, but disastrous for the long term.  How many of you out there would like working for a boss with a track record like that, knowing you might get demoted next year so that energetic young intern can have your job?  

Do I sound crazy?  Maybe so.  But I say with the utmost confidence that some of our FL hs coaching legends of the past would not be waiting on the FHSAA to tell them what they can/should do or not do.  These guys had a moral compass they followed.  They made decisions based on what was the "right thing to do"...not necessarily what everyone else was doing.

 

  

 

I would like to add to this great post.

If it is so important to your school to win state every year, why not hire the best coach you can. I'm not talking about the coach that encourages transfers but the one that builds teams from inside the program. Win it with what you teach.

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On 9/15/2019 at 9:59 PM, badbird said:

Deflect deflect deflect.  It’s ok. no one cares anymore.  Heck just go ahead and claim a title

No one that matters cares anymore it appears. 

 

On 9/16/2019 at 9:27 PM, HornetFan said:

 if you're recruiting, you're cheating.

Something you can't prove but only make baseless allegations about.

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21 hours ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

How exactly is he gonna play with a in season transfer??

 

Transfers

Student-athletes are immediately eligible (as long as they meet all other eligibility standards – including, but not limited to age, limit of eligibility, pre-participation physical exam, GPA, and consent and liability release) at the school in which he or she first attends each school year; the school in which the student makes himself or herself a candidate for an athletic team by engaging in practice or tryouts before enrolling; or the school to which the student has transferred in accordance with s. 1006.20 (2) (a).

If the transfer occurs during the school year, the student may seek to immediately join an existing team if:

  • A roster spot is available
  • The student has the requisite skill and ability to participate in the sport according to the coach of the team
  • The student has not participated in the same sport at another school during the same school year – unless the student meets one of the following exceptions:
  1. Dependent child of active duty military personnel whose move resulted from military orders
  2. Relocation due to a foster care placement in a different school zone
  3. Move due to court-ordered change in custody due to separation or divorce, or the serious illness or death of a custodial parent
  4. Authorized for good cause in the district or charter school policy

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3 hours ago, Legion37 said:

No one that matters cares anymore it appears. 

 

Something you can't prove but only make baseless allegations about.

I know the Pouncey brothers went on to careers in the NFL and they were home-grown, but almost all HS football players never get a sniff of the NFL, even those transfers you recruit from other schools.  Fortunately with Lakeland's booming economy, those graduates can go on to careers at McDonalds and Wendys. You don't have to be ethical to earn minimum wage and flip burgers.

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2 hours ago, HornetFan said:

I know the Pouncey brothers went on to careers in the NFL and they were home-grown, but almost all HS football players never get a sniff of the NFL, even those transfers you recruit from other schools.  Fortunately with Lakeland's booming economy, those graduates can go on to careers at McDonalds and Wendys. You don't have to be ethical to earn minimum wage and flip burgers.

Hahahahahahaha 

Well there you have it... Nothing of value! 

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