Rockledge Gets Pounded by St Ignatius

[OldSchoolLion]

The No. 8 St. Ignatius Wildcats have played quality football teams all season – Mentor and Archbishop Hoban are just two the Wildcats have gone up against.  On Saturday night, the Wildcats faced another good team in the Rockledge (Fla.) Raiders, a team that was undefeated before it traveled to Ohio. The Wildcats defeated the Raiders, 42-7, at Byers Field to end its losing streak at two games and boost their playoff hopes.

St. Ignatius came into the week ranked 12th in the OHSAA’s Division I, Region 1 computer playoff ratings. The top eight teams make the playoffs.  St. Ignatius (3-3) was led by senior quarterback Griffin Hanna, who threw four touchdowns and ran for one. Hanna came in needing 10 passing yards to reach 1,000 on the season, and he far exceeded that number, throwing for 323 yards. Two of Hanna’s touchdowns went to senior Connor Cmiel, who had three receptions for 93 yards. Hanna also threw touchdowns to senior Jack Welsch and senior Henry Cook.

“Offensively, it was kind of one-on-one coverage, and Griffin was getting a pretty good feel where we could have a good matchup,” Kyle said. “And Connor Cmiel’s a pretty good matchup, so is Henry Cook and (Jake) Lang.”  Cmiel and Lang, a senior tight end, combined for eight receptions. Lang finished with 79 yards.

St. Ignatius tied a season-high for points scored, equaling its Week 3 total in a win against Archbishop Hoban.  But along with their offense, the Wildcats also had perhaps their best defensive performance of the season. St. Ignatius held the Raiders to a season-low for points. Before Saturday, the Raiders had scored at least 41 points twice this season.  St. Ignatius contained Rockledge quarterback Elias Allen in the pocket, tallying three sacks. The Wildcats gave up 239 yards of total offense, and they held senior running back Ladarius Tennison to 44 rushing yards. Tennison ran it in for the Raiders’ lone score in the second quarter.

Next for the Wildcats is a game against rival St. Edward at Lakewood Stadium on Oct. 12 at 7 p.m.

 

[DarterBlue2]

I thought Rockledge would have kept it closer. Hard loss for the Central Florida area to swallow. 

[OldSchoolLion]

I believe that makes it OH 3 FL 0 so far this year

Winter Park 21 vs Pick Central,OH 34

Clearwater Academy 54 vs Elder,OH 61

 

...historically versus Ohio...some of the bigger games

St Thomas Aquinas 35 vs Elder (OH) 24    2008

Miami Central 24 vs Elder(OH) 21     2011     (Central ultimately forfeited game)

Lakeland 25 vs St Xavier (OH) 22 (OT)     2006

St Edward (OH) 24 vs Cocoa 14     2015

St Edward (OH) 47 vs Mainland 28     2015

St Edward (OH) 14 vs Chaminade-Madonna 7     2006

Colerain (OH) 17 vs Cocoa 7     2011

Glenville (OH) 26 vs Dwyer 22     2010

[badbird]

Florida football is not good.  Can we stop playing teams from out of state so we can feel better about ourselves and then we can believe columbiafan that we are the best state.  

[OldSchoolLion]

5 minutes ago, DarterBlue2 said:

I thought Rockledge would have kept it closer. Hard loss for the Central Florida area to swallow. 

As of beginning of the season, a breakdown by region in bigger games vs OOS teams over the past 15 seasons.  Central FL has not represented particularly well. 

South FL teams vs OOS   32-24

Central FL teams vs OOS   13-24

North FL teams vs OOS   4-18

[DisabledAccount]

7 minutes ago, badbird said:

Florida football is not good.  Can we stop playing teams from out of state so we can feel better about ourselves and then we can believe columbiafan that we are the best state.  

No state produces better talent

 

If these other states were so good then why does USC, Auburn, Alabama, Texas, UGA, Clemson, Ohio State, Michigan, ect. Always coming and trying to get studs from FL??

 

If Florida is a garbage state they should be able to get better players from their own state right???

[OldSchoolLion]

Great talent does not necessarily equate to great teams.

[DisabledAccount]

4 minutes ago, OldSchoolLion said:

As of beginning of the season, a breakdown by region in bigger games vs OOS teams over the past 15 seasons.  Central FL has not represented particularly well. 

South FL teams vs OOS   32-24

Central FL teams vs OOS   13-24

North FL teams vs OOS   4-18

Do you have a list of those North FL teams vs OOS by any chance? 

 

I thought you may have posted it on a thread somewhere but I wasn't sure

[DisabledAccount]

Just now, OldSchoolLion said:

Great talent does not necessarily equate to great teams.

That I can't disagree with, overall the coaching and support in Florida doesn't come close to matching the talent in Florida and that usually gets exposed when they face stronger teams from other states

[OldSchoolLion]

1 minute ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Do you have a list of those North FL teams vs OOS by any chance? 

 

I thought you may have posted it on a thread somewhere but I wasn't sure

 

[OldSchoolLion]

7 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

No state produces better talent

 

...at certain positions.  DB's...Fl is right up there...linemen, qb's...no way

[OldSchoolLion]

13 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

No state produces better talent

 

If these other states were so good then why does USC, Auburn, Alabama, Texas, UGA, Clemson, Ohio State, Michigan, ect. Always coming and trying to get studs from FL??

 

If Florida is a garbage state they should be able to get better players from their own state right???

What is holding Florida back in terms of offering the "complete package" of recruiting talent to colleges?  ...offensive linemen and quarterbacks.  I've done threads about this in the past.  It's a bit like bragging about your fancy new jeans, but they have a hole in each leg.  Considering the population size of Florida and the outrageous talent produced at other positions, the gaps at these two positions are glaring.  

Florida produces some very good linemen, but even some of our better ones struggle to find a starting spot at the Power 5 colleges.  Last season, no offensive linemen from Miami-Dade, Palm Beach or Hillsborough counties served as a starter at any Power 5 schools outside Florida. Orange County had 1.  The same can be said for FL quarterbacks.

Although it may not produce the sheer number of talented recruits as Florida, Georgia is arguably a more well-rounded recruiting ground in terms of finding talent at all of the positions.  Georgia is heavily recruited for linemen and had offensive linemen starting at Power 5 universities in 11 different states, including California and Oregon.

[DisabledAccount]

1 minute ago, OldSchoolLion said:

...at certain positions.  DB's...Fl is right up there...linemen, qb's...no way

I was speaking in just overall 

 

Unless something has changed in last year or 2 FL is still in the lead for most D1 college players produced and most active NFL players 

 

Have other states been slowly closing the gap and making the battle for talent more competitive? Sure 

 

But being close doesn't mean surpassed, overall I still feel coaching is the biggest thing working against FL in these OOS games 

[DisabledAccount]

Just now, OldSchoolLion said:

What is holding Florida back in terms of offering the "complete package" of recruiting talent to colleges?  ...offensive linemen and quarterbacks.  I've done threads about this in the past.  It's a bit like bragging about your fancy new jeans, but they have a hole in each leg.  Considering the population size of Florida and the outrageous talent produced at other positions, the gaps at these two positions are glaring.  

Florida produces some very good linemen, but even some of our better ones struggle to find a starting spot at the Power 5 colleges.  Last season, no offensive linemen from Miami-Dade, Palm Beach or Hillsborough counties served as a starter at any Power 5 schools outside Florida. Orange County had 1.  The same can be said for FL quarterbacks.

Although it may not produce the sheer number of talented recruits as Florida, Georgia is arguably a more well-rounded recruiting ground in terms of finding talent at all of the positions.  Georgia is heavily recruited for linemen and had offensive linemen starting at Power 5 universities in 11 different states, including California and Oregon.

True but keep in mind California and Texas are much larger states as well but FL still has them beat overall in terms of future college and NFL players produced

 

You have mentioned before that a state like Mississippi or Louisiana per captia is up there and maybe even higher then FL and could potentially produce similar or better numbers then FL if they had a equal population but if so why isn't Texas and California destroying FL number wise despite being 2 power states in their own right and being far higher population wise then FL??

 

 

 

......

 

 

Personally I feel like to answer your question about the OL struggles the area in FL that usually produces the stronger OL would be the panhandle, but over the past decade or so the panhandle has slowly declined in terms of talent and even numbers

 

Look at a school like Choctawhatchee who used to be a powerhouse in North Florida but the lack of stability has slowly dropped that program off their perch and it feels like the development and coaching of OL in FL has been in decline lately (which goes back to many coaches leaving the state) 

 

OL is one of those positions where you can play if you have size but if you aren't developed properly you won't make it far at the next level, in high school you may be able to outsize people but you ain't outsizing people at the next level, you got to be good fundamentally and know how to block correctly or these DL at college level will use their technical abilities to shred right through you

 

 

 

.....

 

QBs and OL are argubly the 2 positions that need to most coaching to be successful at the next level because it's the 2 main positions where long term development is key for future success, so I do feel the struggles at those positions can be linked to the decline of coaching in FL

[DisabledAccount]

@OldSchoolLion I just looked through that list, I want to ask you a question

 

Just through observation of these results was there really any results that would have been a surprise to you? 

 

 

I saw a few FL could have won but I wasn't sure how many I could say FL IMO would have been favorites and then lost it but maybe I missed something

 

 

North FL losses

 

Dematha(MD) 26 vs Godby 9     2013

Byrnes(SC) 38 vs Lincoln 0     2008

Westview (TX) 66 vs Niceville 7     2017

Daphne(AL) 32 vs Pensacola 0     2005

Daphne(AL) 29 vs Lincoln 26     2005

Daphne(AL) 38 vs Lincoln 22     2006

Clay-Chalkville (AL) 44 vs Niceville 23     2014

Coffee County (GA) 49 vs University Christian 28     2016

Coffee County(GA) 20 vs Madison County 19     2007

Cartersville (GA) 52 Bartram Trail 45     2017

Valdosta (GA) 35 vs Lincoln 31     2010

Valdosta (GA) 10 vs Lincoln 7     2011

Valdosta(GA) 21 vs Lincoln 17     2007

Valdosta(GA) 33 vs Lincoln 14     2004

Buford (GA) 17 vs Trinity Christian 0     2014

Marist (GA) 17 vs Godby 14     2014

Colquitt County (GA) 20 vs Madison County 19     2011

North Gwinnett (GA) 35 vs St Augustine 17     2011

 

 

 

North FL wins

Lincoln 24 vs Valdosta(GA) 21     2006

Lincoln 20 vs Valdosta(GA) 19     2005 

Madison County 29 vs Valdosta(GA) 28     2005

Madison County 15 vs Valdosta(GA) 7

 

 

 

 

also I noted the teams who appeared multiple times

 

Lincoln  2-7

Madison County  2-2

Niceville  0-2

Godby  0-2

 

 

 

And the teams who appeared once

 

 

 

St Augustine  0-1

Trinity Christian  0-1

Bartram Trail  0-1

University Christian  0-1

Pensacola  0-1

 

 

 

Another interesting note was almost half of games were involving Lincoln who played in 9 of 22 games 

[badbird]

1 hour ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

No state produces better talent

 

If these other states were so good then why does USC, Auburn, Alabama, Texas, UGA, Clemson, Ohio State, Michigan, ect. Always coming and trying to get studs from FL??

 

If Florida is a garbage state they should be able to get better players from their own state right???

you are once again changing the narrative.  We are talking teams not talent.  

[OldSchoolLion]

52 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

You have mentioned before that a state like Mississippi or Louisiana per captia is up there and maybe even higher then FL and could potentially produce similar or better numbers then FL if they had a equal population but if so why isn't Texas and California destroying FL number wise despite being 2 power states in their own right and being far higher population wise then FL??

 

...two contributing factors may be demographics and regional preferences for certain sports.  

For example, California's population is approximately double that of Florida's. 3 million Blacks live in Florida and 2.3 million live in California. Thus, those two states are demographically somewhat diverse.  And I do not believe the popularity of high school football is quite as homogeneous as it is in Florida, as evidenced by the limited number of northern CA teams we have seen in the national polls over the years.

In Texas, 40% of the state's population is Hispanic (versus 23% in FL).  American football may not be particularly popular amongst many of those millions of Latinos in Texas.

 

[DisabledAccount]

1 minute ago, badbird said:

you are once again changing the narrative.  We are talking teams not talent.  

Isn't talent one of the factors that goes into evaluating how good a state is however??

[OldSchoolLion]

1 minute ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Isn't talent one of the factors that goes into evaluating how good a state is however??

Last time I checked, football is a team sport 

[DisabledAccount]

3 minutes ago, OldSchoolLion said:

...two contributing factors may be demographics and regional preferences for certain sports.  

For example, California's population is approximately double that of Florida's. 3 million Blacks live in Florida and 2.3 million live in California. Thus, those two states are demographically somewhat diverse.  And I do not believe the popularity of high school football is quite as homogeneous as it is in Florida, as evidenced by the limited number of northern CA teams we have seen in the national polls over the years.

In Texas, 40% of the state's population is Hispanic (versus 23% in FL).  American football is not particularly popular amongst those millions of Latinos in Texas.

 

Another thing I'm curious about is when they take count for per captia in each state for analysis of numbers like how many per person in State A play at college level do they take the entire state population or just the population involving the age group being studied (15-25~) age range

 

In other words do they take the entire state or do they only judge it based on the numbers of high school players who eventually go pro?

[badbird]

Just now, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Isn't talent one of the factors that goes into evaluating how good a state is however??

We have the most talent but the quality of the product put on the field we are barely top 5.  We have power talent but not power teams.  With all the transferring going on now you would think we would have far more super teams.  We have no super teams not named IMG.  The closest thing we have to some of these teams is Lakeland.  Great coach, great program, great community that cares about football.  The rest of the state overall is pathetic and only going to get worse because less and less people are caring about high school football in Florida. 

[DisabledAccount]

2 minutes ago, OldSchoolLion said:

Last time I checked, football is a team sport 

It is, that's why you saw teams like Yulee with one star player (Derrick Henry) not get far in the playoffs 

 

Though once we start talking statewide and you have as much talent crawling around as you see in Florida we see teams that will have loads of talent on them and it becomes a collection of talent (a team) more so then just one individual player

 

 

Though granted we have seen countless times that the coaching issue in FL has hurt them when facing strong teams from other states 

[DisabledAccount]

2 minutes ago, badbird said:

We have the most talent but the quality of the product put on the field we are barely top 5.  We have power talent but not power teams.  With all the transferring going on now you would think we would have far more super teams.  We have no super teams not named IMG.  The closest thing we have to some of these teams is Lakeland.  Great coach, great program, great community that cares about football.  The rest of the state overall is pathetic and only going to get worse because less and less people are caring about high school football in Florida. 

It feels like sooner or later any team/program that can establish stability and get a coach to stay long term and build up (which is very rare now) will be the teams that will begin holding the top spot since with the lack of stability in most areas teams will begin falling off

[OldSchoolLion]

2 minutes ago, badbird said:

We have the most talent but the quality of the product put on the field we are barely top 5.  We have power talent but not power teams.  With all the transferring going on now you would think we would have far more super teams.  We have no super teams not named IMG.  The closest thing we have to some of these teams is Lakeland.  Great coach, great program, great community that cares about football.  The rest of the state overall is pathetic and only going to get worse because less and less people are caring about high school football in Florida. 

I am glad you bring up community.  IMO, one has to consider fan base/support in measuring overall "greatness."  How can we crow about how great FL hs football is when the stands are so often empty?  

 

 

[badbird]

Just now, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

It feels like sooner or later any team/program that can establish stability and get a coach to stay long term and build up (which is very rare now) will be the teams that will begin holding the top spot since with the lack of stability in most areas teams will begin falling off

It's a culture.  Lake City use to have it.  Times have changed here and trust me it has effected the level of play.  We have individuals not teams.