Rpi question

[badbird]

41 minutes ago, Stangs1 said:

Mandarin loss to 8-0 Bartram.   7-0 st Thomas aquinas.   And 5-3   Lee in the rain on the road.  Now sitting out of the playoffs.  Smh

Aren't they district champs?

[Steinbrenner Warriors]

No Bartram will be

[h8r]

1 hour ago, Stangs1 said:

WP Got waxed last year at home in the playoffs.  Their players even said after the game, we got a great record but we played nobody.  I thought they would be Mandarins  toughest test last year.  Turned out to be one of the easier games.

hold the phone,

let the h8 pour out.

kudos on the state title, but dont throw stones.

winter park the last 3 seasons

18-loss in 2nd round to state champ mandarin

17-region finals, played spruce creek apopka and wekiva in playoffs.  pretty solid group

16-region finals, played wekiva, timber creek and seminole, again, solid group. seminole was loaded that year

mandarin last 3 seasons

18 state champs

17 didnt make playoffs

16 didnt make playoffs

sun shines on a dogs @$$ every once in a while, but hard to say another team is soft, or sucks or plays a weak schedule when they were in 2nd round or better last 3 seasons. and consistently one of the better schools in football in central florida.

they also win the states all sports award more times than anyone I can think of.....

[Stangs1]

28 minutes ago, badbird said:

Aren't they district champs?

No, Bartram is.

[Floridaatlantic1]

Main problem with the Playoff system is similar to last years. If your district has a few dogs in it, than you have a tough time at getting a wildcard playoff spot, so you have to win the district. I liked the old system better but would have somehow had a wildcard 3 way shootout for one of the spots for great teams stuck in a killer district. Also, I would not have had district champ and runner up face until third round instead of second. We created more problems with the playoff system than we solved. You know the system is lousy when they have changed it every year since it started.

[Stangs1]

16 minutes ago, h8r said:

hold the phone,

let the h8 pour out.

kudos on the state title, but dont throw stones.

winter park the last 3 seasons

18-loss in 2nd round to state champ mandarin

17-region finals, played spruce creek apopka and wekiva in playoffs.  pretty solid group

16-region finals, played wekiva, timber creek and seminole, again, solid group. seminole was loaded that year

mandarin last 3 seasons

18 state champs

17 didnt make playoffs

16 didnt make playoffs

sun shines on a dogs @$$ every once in a while, but hard to say another team is soft, or sucks or plays a weak schedule when they were in 2nd round or better last 3 seasons. and consistently one of the better schools in football in central florida.

they also win the states all sports award more times than anyone I can think of.....

RPI matters this year. Mandarin had a coaching turnover those years.  Would loved for mandarin to have playes in that division in the years u mentioned.  Mandarin 2017 schedule again was as good as anyone's that year.  Lee, Raines, spruce (good that year,) flagler palm coast, Godby, Apopka,  Sandalwood 

[Joshua Wilson]

1 hour ago, Stangs1 said:

Mandarin loss to 8-0 Bartram.   7-0 st Thomas aquinas.   And 5-3   Lee in the rain on the road.  Now sitting out of the playoffs.  Smh

Mandarin is one place out of being in the playoffs with two games left. If you are judging things now, that is probably not the best way to look at this. Mandarin wins out they probably will be in (or even if they go 6-4 they could still be in).

[Stangs1]

1 minute ago, Joshua Wilson said:

Mandarin is one place out of being in the playoffs with two games left. If you are judging things now, that is probably not the best way to look at this. Mandarin wins out they probably will be in (or even if they go 6-4 they could still be in).

I gotcha.  They got to win out and take care of business first of all or none of it matters.  I just wished after losing 18 starters from last year that our lee and bartram games were coming up now as we are playing better.  My point is, i liked it when it came down to top 2 for each. 

[Stangs1]

But, i also agree, every system will have problems,  even if u let 5-12 play each other for the final 4 spots because if the lower seed wins, it will kind of make the regular season meaningless to some..

[h8r]

19 minutes ago, Floridaatlantic1 said:

Main problem with the Playoff system is similar to last years. If your district has a few dogs in it, than you have a tough time at getting a wildcard playoff spot, so you have to win the district. I liked the old system better but would have somehow had a wildcard 3 way shootout for one of the spots for great teams stuck in a killer district. Also, I would not have had district champ and runner up face until third round instead of second. We created more problems with the playoff system than we solved. You know the system is lousy when they have changed it every year since it started.

agree with alot of what you said, 

the 2nd round deal is because of travel, 

add in you get some home made rivalrys that arent a natural one.

like osceola has played dr phillips several times the last few years in the 2nd or 3rd round, im old dont remember which one.

rpi is interesting, i dont like it much, but it sure does make you figure out some schedules if your in 1 of those tough districts.  just to get in the dance

[Joshua Wilson]

2 minutes ago, Stangs1 said:

But, i also agree, every system will have problems,  even if u let 5-12 play each other for the final 4 spots because if the lower seed wins, it will kind of make the regular season meaningless to some..

Correct... I think there is a couple of more things the FHSAA can do to help with everything.

1. Consolidate the four regions into two regions - North and South...  Higher classes have 8 districts in each region seed each region 1-16 with the eight district champs guaranteed no less than No. 8, then after that 8 wildcards go based on RPI

2. Reduce football from eight classes to seven classes. That would increase the size of the districts.

3. And speaking of districts, bring back districts for the lower classes. Going back to my first point, you would do the same except you only have four districts in the North and four in the South and you would take 12 teams per region... seeds 1-4 get the first-round bye while 5-12 are seeded accordingly based upon the RPI. 

I think if the FHSAA can work on these three areas, you will have a lot of happy coaches and they won't mind the RPI deciding the wildcards as long as everyone has a chance to compete for a district. Now a few schools will probably yell at me because they don't want to play XYZ because they won't have a chance. Maybe so for a district title, but to get a wildcard... it leaves the door for many of teams to get one. 

[Stangs1]

Excellent idea.  

[shredstar]

40 minutes ago, Joshua Wilson said:

Correct... I think there is a couple of more things the FHSAA can do to help with everything.

1. Consolidate the four regions into two regions - North and South...  Higher classes have 8 districts in each region seed each region 1-16 with the eight district champs guaranteed no less than No. 8, then after that 8 wildcards go based on RPI

2. Reduce football from eight classes to seven classes. That would increase the size of the districts.

3. And speaking of districts, bring back districts for the lower classes. Going back to my first point, you would do the same except you only have four districts in the North and four in the South and you would take 12 teams per region... seeds 1-4 get the first-round bye while 5-12 are seeded accordingly based upon the RPI. 

I think if the FHSAA can work on these three areas, you will have a lot of happy coaches and they won't mind the RPI deciding the wildcards as long as everyone has a chance to compete for a district. Now a few schools will probably yell at me because they don't want to play XYZ because they won't have a chance. Maybe so for a district title, but to get a wildcard... it leaves the door for many of teams to get one. 

1.  Yes.  Mandarin would potentially be a difficult draw for a district champion right out of the gate. Obviously, someone would still draw them, but larger regions would spread it out more.  Not much different than Lee and Edgewater being "mis-seeded" due to the wild card format last year.

2.  Maybe even six classes.  Furthermore, any playoff format that includes the North Florida Educational Institute, who is just plain bad, cannot be taken seriously.

3.  Would solve a lot of scheduling problems.

All good ideas, which is why they probably won't do them.

As for Mandarin, they should win their last two barring any lapses like they had during the beginning of the third quarter last week.   Four of the teams above them play one another this week, so the losers of those games will be dropping.  Winning their last two should put them in the 6/7 range.  If they happen to lose one then they have no business in the playoffs in the first place.  They do not have any "bad" losses this year, but losing to either Ed White or Fletcher would fall into that category.

 

[Stangs1]

Agreed.  Fletcher playing well with 5 straight wins but i agree, if u are a playoff team, you have to win both. 

[blystr2002]

You bring back districts in lower classes and you lose a bunch of teams back to independent within a few years.  A few teams right now are in the playoffs or on the edge that were independent the better part of last 8 years because they were forced to play teams they just couldn't handle and kids were leaving.  Catch 22. Does the FHSAA want to lose people again? It is also not as simple as building a program up to compete either in today's modern day of transfers. Average small schools with 25-35 kids can't afford even 2 senior transfers because they sucked one year. 

[Joshua Wilson]

2 hours ago, blystr2002 said:

You bring back districts in lower classes and you lose a bunch of teams back to independent within a few years.  A few teams right now are in the playoffs or on the edge that were independent the better part of last 8 years because they were forced to play teams they just couldn't handle and kids were leaving.  Catch 22. Does the FHSAA want to lose people again? It is also not as simple as building a program up to compete either in today's modern day of transfers. Average small schools with 25-35 kids can't afford even 2 senior transfers because they sucked one year. 

But they complained they couldn't make the playoffs because of powerhouse teams in the same district which I understand. That is why you wildcard spots out instead of taking a runner-up. It doesn't close that door to getting to the postseason. It is a Catch 22, but you got more schools starting to say hey we really would like a district back because some teams are having a tough time getting any kind of schedule together. 

[CoachK]

I would bet that there many small schools who will barely qualify or just miss playoffs that are happy with the current system.  They can choose their own schedule and would rather go 5-5 than be ‘forced’ to play teams that roll over them.  

[Joshua Wilson]

22 minutes ago, CoachK said:

I would bet that there many small schools who will barely qualify or just miss playoffs that are happy with the current system.  They can choose their own schedule and would rather go 5-5 than be ‘forced’ to play teams that roll over them.  

You do have a valid point there. It is a true Catch 22. That is why it is idea No. 3 and not idea No. 1. I rather see the first two things happen first to start with. 

[Big Ray]

1 hour ago, Joshua Wilson said:

But they complained they couldn't make the playoffs because of powerhouse teams in the same district which I understand. That is why you wildcard spots out instead of taking a runner-up. It doesn't close that door to getting to the postseason. It is a Catch 22, but you got more schools starting to say hey we really would like a district back because some teams are having a tough time getting any kind of schedule together. 

 I know they tweaked the playoff formula after a 0-9 team went to the playoffs, but I think district champs and runner ups should make the playoffs. For the schools that complained about not making the playoffs because of powerhouse schools in their district, there is a solution to that, GET BETTER!!

[Joshua Wilson]

Just now, Big Ray said:

 I know they tweaked the playoff formula after a 0-9 team went to the playoffs, but I think district champs and runner ups should make the playoffs. For the schools that complained about not making the playoffs because of powerhouse schools in their district, there is a solution to that, GET BETTER!!

Easier said than done these days... you can thank the Florida Legislature for HB 7029 several years ago for loosening up transfer rules.

[badbird]

18 hours ago, Stangs1 said:

No, Bartram is.

Ouch.  Hopefully Mandarin gets in.  Just shows how crappy the system is that a border line top 50-60 team is currently out of the playoffs.

[badbird]

19 hours ago, h8r said:

hold the phone,

let the h8 pour out.

kudos on the state title, but dont throw stones.

winter park the last 3 seasons

18-loss in 2nd round to state champ mandarin

17-region finals, played spruce creek apopka and wekiva in playoffs.  pretty solid group

16-region finals, played wekiva, timber creek and seminole, again, solid group. seminole was loaded that year

mandarin last 3 seasons

18 state champs

17 didnt make playoffs

16 didnt make playoffs

sun shines on a dogs @$$ every once in a while, but hard to say another team is soft, or sucks or plays a weak schedule when they were in 2nd round or better last 3 seasons. and consistently one of the better schools in football in central florida.

they also win the states all sports award more times than anyone I can think of.....

Don't forget got a few stud recruits err transfers in 2018

[h8r]

1 hour ago, badbird said:

Don't forget got a few stud recruits err transfers in 2018

no debate on that!

winning does bring better players in, we all know that.  and with the pretty open transfer rule, kinda, sorta, its free agency season in some places!

[blackmagic]

How would a pahokee feel about getting placed in a district? Would they have the option to move up? That's a lot of travel for 2-3 district games a year. What about the schools that would have to travel to the muck? Whoever in that district won't be happy. Will FHSAA give some assistance? Probably not. 

I say put them in a district but give the district control on what they want to do. Just like in other sports. Either they want to play a district schedule or let the RPI decide the district. 

[badbird]

26 minutes ago, blackmagic said:

How would a pahokee feel about getting placed in a district? Would they have the option to move up? That's a lot of travel for 2-3 district games a year. What about the schools that would have to travel to the muck? Whoever in that district won't be happy. Will FHSAA give some assistance? Probably not. 

I say put them in a district but give the district control on what they want to do. Just like in other sports. Either they want to play a district schedule or let the RPI decide the district. 

well 1A cried about small private schools so there are not many teams in 1A.  If you do districts teams will have to travel.  They need to combine 1A and 2A and then travel wouldn't be as big of an issue