FHSAA Medic saying Delay Football / Vollyball till further notice

[Silver King]

Damn... we just got delayed to return to school Aug 31 in Charlotte County Sarasota too.

From Manny Navvaro Tweet:

"Sports Medicine Advisory Committee Chair Dr. Jennifer Maynard is giving the organization’s recommendation to the FHSAA about a return to fall sports and says these are their recommendations: “Delay the start of football and girls volleyball until further notice.”

 

Sorry didn't see the earlier post!

 

 

5:25 PM · Jul 20, 2020"

 

 

 

 

 

[DarterBlue2]

It does not look good, but if we don't have a season, I understand. I would not want coaches and players to unnecessarily come down with the virus. If we don't have a season, hopefully by next year this is behind us.  

[gatorman-uf]

FHSAA chooses to do nothing, but allow for voluntary post-season and allow the regular season to extend into post-season.

https://www.news4jax.com/sports/2020/07/21/fhsaa-settles-on-framework-for-fall-sports-season/?__vfz=medium%3Dsharebar

[WhoopWhoop!!]

I’m honestly stunned after watching that fiasco of a meeting. They were tasked with making a decision for the entire state, and medical professionals said we should delay (I want to say at least 28 days), yet me move ahead with original start date because small counties like Gulf County are good to go?

[gatorman-uf]

1 hour ago, WhoopWhoop!! said:

I’m honestly stunned after watching that fiasco of a meeting. They were tasked with making a decision for the entire state, and medical professionals said we should delay (I want to say at least 28 days), yet me move ahead with original start date because small counties like Gulf County are good to go?

Welcome to Flori-duh. 

[WhoopWhoop!!]

5 minutes ago, gatorman-uf said:

Welcome to Flori-duh. 

Lived here my whole life and thought I might’ve seen it all. I’ll say this, if they ask me, a coach, to sign a waiver on all this, I’ll will refuse to sign, even if they say I can’t get my supplement. I’ll coach for the kids and respect of my other coaches I work with, but starting our season this coming Monday is insane. We are literally the epicenter of the world, currently today, for this pandemic, yet we can start football? 

[muckboy561]

Safety is important

[Perspective]

Whoop, I hear what you are saying.   Sounds like you're a high school football coach.  Let me ask you a serious question -- not one to start an argument or take a side, but simply to make a point.   What have your kids (and by "your kids," I mean the ones you coach) been doing lately?   Here's why I'm asking.   I keep seeing pictures on social media of 7 on 7's and camps where literally hundreds of kids are coming together and playing games and doing drills that involve close contact.   My hunch is that the longer they wait to start "real" football, the more these things will continue. 

Again, don't take this as a defense of what the FHSAA 'decided' last night.  Instead, it's more of a recognition that the kids are going to be interacting with each other in close quarters no matter what they decided. 

Last point:  I see a lot of parallels with how the county has handled this whole Covid thing:  everyone wants to push the hard decisions onto someone else's plate so that they won't get blamed with the repercussions.    National government shifts the burden to the state government who then shifts the burden to the cities and counties . . . at least until the cities or counties start taking a more restrictive approach than the state (see, for example, Georgia/Atlanta).  Ultimately, what the FHSAA did last night was to say, "hey, if your county thinks it's safe, then go for it."   Some will; some won't.   Some have already said they're going to push back the start date (Orange Co. for example). 

By the way, the Board is going to meet again end of this week/first of next week.  I'm not sure this issue is completely over with yet. 

[HornetFan]

28 minutes ago, Perspective said:

Whoop, I hear what you are saying.   Sounds like you're a high school football coach.  Let me ask you a serious question -- not one to start an argument or take a side, but simply to make a point.   What have your kids (and by "your kids," I mean the ones you coach) been doing lately?   Here's why I'm asking.   I keep seeing pictures on social media of 7 on 7's and camps where literally hundreds of kids are coming together and playing games and doing drills that involve close contact.   My hunch is that the longer they wait to start "real" football, the more these things will continue. 

Again, don't take this as a defense of what the FHSAA 'decided' last night.  Instead, it's more of a recognition that the kids are going to be interacting with each other in close quarters no matter what they decided. 

Last point:  I see a lot of parallels with how the county has handled this whole Covid thing:  everyone wants to push the hard decisions onto someone else's plate so that they won't get blamed with the repercussions.    National government shifts the burden to the state government who then shifts the burden to the cities and counties . . . at least until the cities or counties start taking a more restrictive approach than the state (see, for example, Georgia/Atlanta).  Ultimately, what the FHSAA did last night was to say, "hey, if your county thinks it's safe, then go for it."   Some will; some won't.   Some have already said they're going to push back the start date (Orange Co. for example). 

By the way, the Board is going to meet again end of this week/first of next week.  I'm not sure this issue is completely over with yet. 

"What have your kids (and by "your kids," I mean the ones you coach) been doing lately?   Here's why I'm asking.   I keep seeing pictures on social media of 7 on 7's and camps where literally hundreds of kids are coming together and playing games and doing drills that involve close contact.   My hunch is that the longer they wait to start "real" football, the more these things will continue."

The kids have been getting together since before the schools were shut down in March and they'll continue to do so. They're kids; they don't fear the virus. I know my grandsons have single and group close contact workouts every week with their non-school coaches. They're doing conditioning drills with their school team. When the coaches leave after conditioning, the kids spend the next 1 1/2 hours playing 7v7. These meetings about starting school and playing football are not so much about the kids as they are about the teachers and coaches, who are possibly at risk from the virus. I commend the coaches for the time they are putting in with these kids during conditioning. I truly believe the coaches want to play football this year and they will do their best to keep the kids as safe as possible.  

[WhoopWhoop!!]

No, I completely hear you and understand that different situations are occurring. We started back with workouts in pods of kids. Within a month we’ve had 3 coaches and over 10 kids test positive, and we are shut down again. But unfortunately I know how folks in my area are, and if the green light says go, we will be back at it. I get kids and some schools will get together, but I find it hard when medical professionals give a recommendation and it’s ignored. I probably ranted a little more than I tend to due to that meeting forcing me to get into my liquor storage. 

[Hwy17]

Sounds to me like the notion of some counties doing their own thing means whatever FHSAA decides is basically mute so might as well let those who want to proceed as normal go ahead.

[WhoopWhoop!!]

Just now, Hwy17 said:

Sounds to me like the notion of some counties doing their own thing means whatever FHSAA decides is basically mute so might as well let those who want to proceed as normal go ahead.

Good point

[gatorman-uf]

1 hour ago, Perspective said:

Last point:  I see a lot of parallels with how the county has handled this whole Covid thing:  everyone wants to push the hard decisions onto someone else's plate so that they won't get blamed with the repercussions.    National government shifts the burden to the state government who then shifts the burden to the cities and counties . . . at least until the cities or counties start taking a more restrictive approach than the state (see, for example, Georgia/Atlanta).  Ultimately, what the FHSAA did last night was to say, "hey, if your county thinks it's safe, then go for it."   Some will; some won't.   Some have already said they're going to push back the start date (Orange Co. for example). 

100% on this. Complete lack of leadership from the top to the bottom. The few people who try to provide leadership are shouted down as chicken littles.

____________ 

Separate issue, I read one of the stories recommended no band, cheerleaders, or fans from the Sports Medicine Advisory Committee. Was this talked about during the 5 hour long meeting or will that be a local decision as well.

[Perspective]

1 hour ago, gatorman-uf said:

___________ 

Separate issue, I read one of the stories recommended no band, cheerleaders, or fans from the Sports Medicine Advisory Committee. Was this talked about during the 5 hour long meeting or will that be a local decision as well.

The entire 7-page SMAC Report was read by the Chairman of the SMAC during the first part of the meeting.  As I recall, and while the committee recognized that ultimately it would be a "local decision," they recommended that games take place without fans, bands or cheerleaders.    The report was referenced several more times over the course of the meeting.  

At one point, during the discussion of possibly delaying the start and pushing everything back, there was discussion that teams might lose that early-season gate money.  Someone replied that wasn't an issue, as there weren't going to be any fans at the games anyway.  Immediate past president/current member Bobby Johns, AD at Wewahitchka High School (small school in the panhandle) was quick to jump in and state that his county's superintendent has already said they will allow fans at games. 

In short, the SMAC report was authored by folks in the medical field and contained several recommendations.   As you might suspect, the report recommended a very cautious and conservative return to sports, especially for football and volleyball.  Those board members from south Florida could relate to the recommendations; others could not.  And, thus, they decided to stick with the status quo . . . at least until the end of this week/beginning of next when the Board meets again, having had a few days to digest the report (which they apparently received sometime yesterday shortly before the meeting began).   On the one hand, this should make you nervous (if you like the outcome of last night's meeting).  On the other hand, when the new chairman tried to get the Board to adopt one of the least cautious recommendations (requiring the schools to adopt a uniform questionnaire and require daily temperature checks), it got shot down.  It wouldn't surprise me if some elements of what SMAC recommended eventually get adopted when the Board reconvenes.   

[Silver King]

22 minutes ago, Perspective said:

Wewahitchka High

...Wewahitchka Low - I bet the local School Boards carve it up good. One thing for certain,  ADs will earn their salaries redoing schedules this season.

[OldSchoolLion]

In the dinosaur days, people had the utmost respect for medical professionals.  What the doc said was gospel.  Now we openly balk at what medical professionals advise because somehow we know better...and I am not just talking about Covid.

If someone with no background in hs football came on here and started spouting off about this and that, imagine how we would laugh the clueless guy off of here.  After all, you better have lived hs football to know something about it, right?  Likewise, the medical community thinks poorly of those with no medical background of any sort making decisions that can profoundly impact the health of others without a true understanding of the risks.  "Nothing has happened here yet" does not necessarily equate to "we are at low risk."  

"Well, kids are going to do it anyway, so..."  I repeatedly here this.  Well, kids are going to smoke, drink and do drugs regardless of our warnings, so we may as well just let 'em, right? ..or heck, let's sponsor supervised events where we can make sure they do it safely.  It's a cop out.  Sure, we cannot control what other parents let their kids do outside of school, and no doubt many kids today are engaging in risky behaviors of all sorts.  That is not cause to say we should use taxpayer dollars to fund similar, at-risk activities in schools at this moment in time if the medical community is warning us.  If you disagree that playing football is an at-risk activity, please let us know where you got your medical degree.

 

 

 

 

 

 

   

 

 

[badbird]

2 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

In the dinosaur days, people had the utmost respect for medical professionals.  What the doc said was gospel.  Now we openly balk at what medical professionals advise because somehow we know better...and I am not just talking about Covid.

If someone with no background in hs football came on here and started spouting off about this and that, imagine how we would laugh the clueless guy off of here.  After all, you better have lived hs football to know something about it, right?  Likewise, the medical community thinks poorly of those with no medical background of any sort making decisions that can profoundly impact the health of others without a true understanding of the risks.  "Nothing has happened here yet" does not necessarily equate to "we are at low risk."  

"Well, kids are going to do it anyway, so..."  I repeatedly here this.  Well, kids are going to smoke, drink and do drugs regardless of our warnings, so we may as well just let 'em, right? ..or heck, let's sponsor supervised events where we can make sure they do it safely.  It's a cop out.  Sure, we cannot control what other parents let their kids do outside of school, and no doubt many kids today are engaging in risky behaviors of all sorts.  That is not cause to say we should use taxpayer dollars to fund similar, at-risk activities in schools at this moment in time if the medical community is warning us.  If you disagree that playing football is an at-risk activity, please let us know where you got your medical degree.

 

 

When they can't keep track of positive tests and people dying in car accidents get counted as covid deaths it makes you skeptical.  I'm not disagreeing with you I'm just pointing out the cluster fudge.  Also Miami and Los Angeles have some of the highest death rates and case numbers and both cities have been masked mandated for a long time.  Once again it makes people skeptical.

[OldSchoolLion]

12 hours ago, badbird said:

When they can't keep track of positive tests and people dying in car accidents get counted as covid deaths it makes you skeptical.  I'm not disagreeing with you I'm just pointing out the cluster fudge.  Also Miami and Los Angeles have some of the highest death rates and case numbers and both cities have been masked mandated for a long time.  Once again it makes people skeptical.

That's a very good point, babdbird.  We often seek simple, black-and-white answers to what can be extremely complex problems.

Think of football.  Somebody unfamiliar with the game might watch a few games and draw certain conclusions based on that limited data set, ie the team with the bigger O-line won every game I watched so that must be the key to winning at football. 

If that person came to you and asked, you would give them a long list of variables that come together in a game and determine whether a team wins or loses.  But they say, "Oh no, that's way to complicated for me, I'd rather just believe what I saw...that the team with the bigger O-line always wins."  You would call them a bonehead and walk away shaking your head.  I think that is how the medical community must feel, at times.  

 

 

[Proseteye]

13 hours ago, badbird said:

When they can't keep track of positive tests and people dying in car accidents get counted as covid deaths it makes you skeptical.  I'm not disagreeing with you I'm just pointing out the cluster fudge.  Also Miami and Los Angeles have some of the highest death rates and case numbers and both cities have been masked mandated for a long time.  Once again it makes people skeptical.

AGREE. They are also allowing the students to gather all day in classrooms, have lunch together, ride buses from home to school and back, and get together for extra curricula activities, but they are worried about a football team practicing outdoors 2 hours a day and playing a game for 3 hours on Friday. I wonder why they don't protect these football teams when flu season comes around ever year like clockwork. After all approximately 40 million get infected, 300,000 hospitalizations, and 70,000 die every year from the so called common flu. How many kids get the flu every year. I'm quite sure quite a few. But, somehow we don't close the entire country down. There is something much more than protecting students in all of this. After all it's been proved that people under 18 have a near zero percentage rate of dying from this Covid-19. I wonder if it has anything to do with their young immune systems that are at peak effectiveness. Isn't that the reason why young people don't die of the common flu when some older folks do? Just saying.

[OldSchoolLion]

7 minutes ago, Proseteye said:

AGREE. They are also allowing the students to gather all day in classrooms, have lunch together, ride buses from home to school and back, and get together for extra curricula activities, but they are worried about a football team practicing outdoors 2 hours a day and playing a game for 3 hours on Friday. I wonder why they don't protect these football teams when flu season comes around ever year like clockwork. After all approximately 40 million get infected, 300,000 hospitalizations, and 70,000 die every year from the so called common flu. How many kids get the flu every year. I'm quite sure quite a few. But, somehow we don't close the entire country down. There is something much more than protecting students in all of this. After all it's been proved that people under 18 have a near zero percentage rate of dying from this Covid-19. I wonder if it has anything to do with their young immune systems that are at peak effectiveness. Isn't that the reason why young people don't die of the common flu when some older folks do? Just saying.

..the joker in the deck.  “There is now more and more evidence emerging about the role of asymptomatic people in the spread of this virus. This is not to be taken lightly. This is like nothing anyone alive has ever seen, and we are all in this together.”  Those words comes from a pediatric, infectious disease doctor who is prominent on the Covid scene.

Am not sharing to debate the extent to which we should or should not be reacting.  Am simply trying to point out that comparing the risks of Covid to other illnesses is likely futile if indeed this is like nothing we have ever seen before.

 

[OldSchoolLion]

Just an FYI...if you aren't familiar with the polio epidemic of last century, you may want to read up on it.  There are some parallels with what is taking place now.  Only 70 years ago there were nationwide discussions similar to those of today.

https://www.npr.org/sections/npr-history-dept/2015/04/10/398515228/defeating-the-disease-that-paralyzed-america

I had a family member who got polio as a child and was in one of the iron lungs you see in the photo.  They lived their entire life impacted by the disease.  Interestingly, with polio it was somewhat the opposite of Covid...it was the kids who were especially susceptible.

 

 

[Proseteye]

12 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

Just an FYI...if you aren't familiar with the polio epidemic of last century, you may want to read up on it.  There are some parallels with what is taking place now.  Only 70 years ago there were nationwide discussions similar to those of today.

https://www.npr.org/sections/npr-history-dept/2015/04/10/398515228/defeating-the-disease-that-paralyzed-america

I had a family member who got polio as a child and was in one of the iron lungs you see in the photo.  They lived their entire life impacted by the disease.  Interestingly, with polio it was somewhat the opposite of Covid...it was the kids who were especially susceptible.

 

 

I lived through the Polio age and remember when the vaccine was discovered and perfected. Took them nearly four years to perfect a vaccine. A horrible experience your family member went through probably for the rest of his/her life. My condolences, truly. As kids we shuddered at the thought of getting Polio.

Covid-19 is of the SARS-CoV family type virus. It's classified as SARS-CoV2 but is structurally somewhat different than SARS-CoV. According to the Lancet Medical Journal Covid-19 is way below the SARS-CoV fatality rate and also very far below the fatality rate for the MERS family of viruses. The US, over the years, has been hit by both SARS and MERS viruses and we survived all of them without shutting things down. By the way, we also survived Poliomyelitis and all of the childhood diseases, most of them viruses, without shutting things down. And there were no vaccines for those childhood diseases until many years later. This is the first time in my lifetime, and I'm an old timer, that any disease has even attempted to cause the country to shutdown. Many many doctors, some of them ICU, emergency room, and specialist type doctors disagree totally with the CDC and believe they are the problem. There are 5 countries that never shutdown and they all survived in better shape than the countries that did shut down. None of them destroyed their economy and locked their people away like POW's. Just saying.

[OldSchoolLion]

8 hours ago, Proseteye said:

I lived through the Polio age and remember when the vaccine was discovered and perfected. Took them nearly four years to perfect a vaccine. A horrible experience your family member went through probably for the rest of his/her life. My condolences, truly. As kids we shuddered at the thought of getting Polio.

Covid-19 is of the SARS-CoV family type virus. It's classified as SARS-CoV2 but is structurally somewhat different than SARS-CoV. According to the Lancet Medical Journal Covid-19 is way below the SARS-CoV fatality rate and also very far below the fatality rate for the MERS family of viruses. The US, over the years, has been hit by both SARS and MERS viruses and we survived all of them without shutting things down. By the way, we also survived Poliomyelitis and all of the childhood diseases, most of them viruses, without shutting things down. And there were no vaccines for those childhood diseases until many years later. This is the first time in my lifetime, and I'm an old timer, that any disease has even attempted to cause the country to shutdown. Many many doctors, some of them ICU, emergency room, and specialist type doctors disagree totally with the CDC and believe they are the problem. There are 5 countries that never shutdown and they all survived in better shape than the countries that did shut down. None of them destroyed their economy and locked their people away like POW's. Just saying.

Yes, polio was very bad.  I don't think we can easily compare the approaches of other countries to ours, or even the approaches of past US generations.  Certain other countries and arguably past generations in the US seem to have an easier time with the concept of doing what is best for the greater good.  Am sure those countries that did not shut down made assumptions about their people's willingness to voluntarily self-distance and behave themselves.  Knowing we in the US are such an independent bunch and that today, more than ever, people go out of their way to prove a point that they can do their own thing, it forces us into a conservative approach.   

[Hwy17]

Just from my point of view, the one person I know who has Covid19 is a health care worker. The nursing home she works in had an outbreak, and while they did a good job of keeping it contained for a couple of months, a patient who had been testing negative suddenly came up positive and now many more have it as a result. From all likelihood another worker there most likely didn't follow proper safety precautions.  Hardee county didn't have it's first confirmed case until about a month or so after the outbreak.  The first confirmed case was a non-resident who returned from traveling abroad. The 2nd confirmed case appears to be a member of the same household.  Then Hardee county suddenly got a large spike in numbers.  While unconfirmed, I have heard that many are from migrant labor camps where people are housed in close quarters. All that said, I know of no one who has contracted Covid19 from simply living their normal day to day life.  I myself only wear a mask when and where I absolutely have to. I may live in Hardee county but I work over in Manatee and Sarasota, both of which have higher numbers than Hardee. I haven't gotten sick, and neither have any of my family.   I do know this, policy making boards (FYI I serve on the city council in Wauchula), are often presented a "set of facts" that don't necessarily give the whole story. God forbid you question the so called experts. Their first objective is to bury any information to the contrary of what they want and discredit any information that may raise objection. And decisions made by policy boards "for the greater good", are usually done from the standpoint of CYA from a lawsuit.

[OldSchoolLion]

It is our utter lack of preparedness as a country to deal with a pandemic that has led us down this path. We did not have the infrastructure to mount a targeted approach, putting resources where they were most needed...the elderly and health care workers. It was easier to sell a broad-brush approach to the public with vague, one-size-fits-all preventative instructions.

Here's an example, and I speak from first hand knowledge, not something I read on the internet.   A US company currently manufacturing facemasks, went to China after the outbreak to buy machines that could produce facemasks so they could provide their own employees and sell them to companies like McDonalds.  As things heated up, there was concern that China would pull the plug on these machines, so the company went to a small manufacturer in Georgia and asked them to dust off 25 year-old blueprints from facemask machines they produced in the 90's.  After numerous technical problems getting the machines to run properly, which exist to this day, this US-based company is having to rely upon their Chinese operations, which use Chinese machines, to provide their US-based employees with facemasks.  

This same company implemented protocols to do temperature checks at all of their US sites, yet struggled to find thermometers to do the task because nearly all of the non-contact thermometers in the US come from overseas, and there has been a tremendous shortage.

We struggled to provide protective equipment to our first responders, our testing protocols this past spring were abysmal, etc etc...The fact that we are having debates over whether teenagers should be playing football is a symptom of a much bigger problem.