2021 Transfer Thread

[DarterBlue2]

On 6/16/2021 at 7:53 PM, FBGUY1989 said:

Exactly I mean could you imagine that type of talent transferring to Columbia High School 

It is a disadvantage for all high schools located in smaller towns/cities. On the other hand, for the same reason, such schools don't lose their best players to transfers too. It's a two edged sword, but it makes it difficult for rural and small town/city schools to win state titles in the current environment. 

[FBGUY1989]

4 hours ago, DarterBlue2 said:

It is a disadvantage for all high schools located in smaller towns/cities. On the other hand, for the same reason, such schools don't lose their best players to transfers too. It's a two edged sword, but it makes it difficult for rural and small town/city schools to win state titles in the current environment. 

Look at Pahokee and Glades Central when they were good 

[DarterBlue2]

1 minute ago, FBGUY1989 said:

Look at Pahokee and Glades Central when they were good 

Pahokee and Glades Central were special cases. They had an unbelievable concentration of talent in the Muck. Unfortunately, with the demise of sugar, they have lost population and as a result are now in the same shoes of most other rural and semi-rural areas. It is not likely that a flood of south Florida talent will transfer to either of those schools. 

[Proseteye]

9 hours ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Sandalwood also seems to pick up a lot of transfers 

 

Raines under Wiley would pick up nearly double digits in transfers 

 

Ed White until they fell off would also pick up big transfer numbers 

 

 

 

But nobody says anything about that so why are TCA the evil empire while the publics are absolved of any criticism?

I am certainly not picking on TCA as Trinity Catholic is in the same boat as the Conquerors as we also pick up transfers from the public schools for what is primarily for sports. I'm not in favor of it but that's what it is these days. Personally I'm for the old FHAA ruling that a player had to wait 1 year after the transfer to be a regular player. That virtually stopped most transfers for sports only. All I was stating is that any team 3A or below, that gets 8 transfers, will completely change the makeup and outcome of that team. What about the players who had been with the school for many years and find themselves sitting out every game because some transfer dropped in from wherever in his Junior or Senior year and has no real affinity with the school beyond sports. This may be the reason why there are only a handful of schools, out of 2,237 high schools in Florida, that are competitive year in and year out in football and in some cases other sports. 

[DisabledAccount]

26 minutes ago, Proseteye said:

I am certainly not picking on TCA as Trinity Catholic is in the same boat as the Conquerors as we also pick up transfers from the public schools for what is primarily for sports. I'm not in favor of it but that's what it is these days. Personally I'm for the old FHAA ruling that a player had to wait 1 year after the transfer to be a regular player. That virtually stopped most transfers for sports only. All I was stating is that any team 3A or below, that gets 8 transfers, will completely change the makeup and outcome of that team. What about the players who had been with the school for many years and find themselves sitting out every game because some transfer dropped in from wherever in his Junior or Senior year and has no real affinity with the school beyond sports. This may be the reason why there are only a handful of schools, out of 2,237 high schools in Florida, that are competitive year in and year out in football and in some cases other sports. 

Well I saw them as likely 2a favorites before they even got a single transfer but that is probably the difference between top 25 to top 10 in Florida with those transfers 

 

There are a lot of reasons for why only a handful of schools are good but I'm not gonna open that can of worms again as I'm sure people will chime in with their usual "shut up clueless kid" bullshit all because people refuse to see the reality of the primary and main reason this state is the way it is 

[DisabledAccount]

TCA definitely has picked up big transfer numbers this year compared to past years 

 

Maybe kids want the easy path to a state title, who knows 

 

 

But I certainly don't feel sorry for the Jacksonville publics who lose "their kids" to TCA as in many cases it wasn't their kids to begin with 

 

I just want people to realize TCA isn't doing anything that Sandalwood, Raines, Mandarin, Lee, First Coast, Ed White, etc. have done in the past or even currently 

 

Those public schools aren't victims of TCA, they just for the most part haven't been able to match the success TCA has had even with more transfers in some cases 

 

Sure Raines and Mandarin have won titles but the others have been failures even with the transfers that on paper should have made them a threat to compete for a title or at least according to their fan base 

[HornetFan]

6 hours ago, Proseteye said:

I am certainly not picking on TCA as Trinity Catholic is in the same boat as the Conquerors as we also pick up transfers from the public schools for what is primarily for sports. I'm not in favor of it but that's what it is these days. Personally I'm for the old FHAA ruling that a player had to wait 1 year after the transfer to be a regular player. That virtually stopped most transfers for sports only. All I was stating is that any team 3A or below, that gets 8 transfers, will completely change the makeup and outcome of that team. What about the players who had been with the school for many years and find themselves sitting out every game because some transfer dropped in from wherever in his Junior or Senior year and has no real affinity with the school beyond sports. This may be the reason why there are only a handful of schools, out of 2,237 high schools in Florida, that are competitive year in and year out in football and in some cases other sports. 

What about the players who had been with the school for many years and find themselves sitting out every game because some transfer dropped in from wherever in his Junior or Senior year

This is the biggest injustice in the transfer rules. Unless a student's family moves to the new district, they should not allow athletic transfers. But, for most fans and too many coaches, there is very little loyalty to the local kid. Winning is more important than every student in a school district being given a chance to participate on their local HS team. 

[DisabledAccount]

43 minutes ago, HornetFan said:

What about the players who had been with the school for many years and find themselves sitting out every game because some transfer dropped in from wherever in his Junior or Senior year

This is the biggest injustice in the transfer rules. Unless a student's family moves to the new district, they should not allow athletic transfers. But, for most fans and too many coaches, there is very little loyalty to the local kid. Winning is more important than every student in a school district being given a chance to participate on their local HS team. 

And I never said that was right 

 

I just tired of people blaming the privates and not saying anything about the publics who do it

 

If people are gonna blast Bolles and TCA for their transfers fine, but I don't want to see the same people talking about programs like Lee building their program from the ground up with home grown talent which is a complete lie 

 

TCA probably is more home grown than Lee is and I want people to see that instead of just assuming because they a public they have done everything by the book 

[DisabledAccount]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[HornetFan]

1 hour ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

And I never said that was right 

 

I just tired of people blaming the privates and not saying anything about the publics who do it

 

If people are gonna blast Bolles and TCA for their transfers fine, but I don't want to see the same people talking about programs like Lee building their program from the ground up with home grown talent which is a complete lie 

 

TCA probably is more home grown than Lee is and I want people to see that instead of just assuming because they a public they have done everything by the book 

"I'm just tired of people blaming the privates and not saying anything about the publics who do it"

You're never going to be able to stop parents from putting their kids in private schools if they can afford the expense. Where Florida is missing the boat is allowing private schools to play in Districts with public schools. I originally come from Long Island. The Catholic schools in the NYC area play in the Catholic High School league. They have their own playoffs and champions. This puts them on equal footing because kids can go to the school of their choice as long as they pay the tuition and supply their own transportation. Florida could set aside a Classification or two strictly for private schools and then clamp down on the public schools when it comes to transfers by requiring kids to play for the school where you family actually lives and pays real estate taxes or have a lease on a home or apartment; no exceptions. 

[DisabledAccount]

14 minutes ago, HornetFan said:

"I'm just tired of people blaming the privates and not saying anything about the publics who do it"

You're never going to be able to stop parents from putting their kids in private schools if they can afford the expense. Where Florida is missing the boat is allowing private schools to play in Districts with public schools. I originally come from Long Island. The Catholic schools in the NYC area play in the Catholic High School league. They have their own playoffs and champions. This puts them on equal footing because kids can go to the school of their choice as long as they pay the tuition and supply their own transportation. Florida could set aside a Classification or two strictly for private schools and then clamp down on the public schools when it comes to transfers by requiring kids to play for the school where you family actually lives and pays real estate taxes or have a lease on a home or apartment; no exceptions. 

Won't happen because then you will see kids having addresses listed with 2nd or 3rd cousins or uncles to team up 

 

It will only further the gap between metro and rural schools who will have the flexibility to do what they want

 

Having a few powerhouse private schools keeps the cheating public schools from having an easy path 

[DarterBlue2]

40 minutes ago, HornetFan said:

"I'm just tired of people blaming the privates and not saying anything about the publics who do it"

You're never going to be able to stop parents from putting their kids in private schools if they can afford the expense. Where Florida is missing the boat is allowing private schools to play in Districts with public schools. I originally come from Long Island. The Catholic schools in the NYC area play in the Catholic High School league. They have their own playoffs and champions. This puts them on equal footing because kids can go to the school of their choice as long as they pay the tuition and supply their own transportation. Florida could set aside a Classification or two strictly for private schools and then clamp down on the public schools when it comes to transfers by requiring kids to play for the school where you family actually lives and pays real estate taxes or have a lease on a home or apartment; no exceptions. 

Under current enacted state regulations, you are allowed to go to any public high school of your choice with the only caveats being that if it is not your zoned school it must not be at capacity and you must provide your own transportation. When this went into effect, the FHSAA essentially gave up on trying to police transfers (not that there were doing a stellar job prior to the change). So, until the legislature goes in a different direction, we are stuck with what we have got. 

In densely populated areas, this basically means that the great majority of talent will tend to congregate at a handful of schools.

[HornetFan]

1 hour ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Won't happen because then you will see kids having addresses listed with 2nd or 3rd cousins or uncles to team up 

 

It will only further the gap between metro and rural schools who will have the flexibility to do what they want

 

Having a few powerhouse private schools keeps the cheating public schools from having an easy path 

Won't happen because then you will see kids having addresses listed with 2nd or 3rd cousins or uncles to team up 

This is where coaches have to have some integrity and put a stop to allowing transfers to use phony residences. An individual that knowingly allows cheating does deserve the title of coach.

It will only further the gap between metro and rural schools who will have the flexibility to do what they want

If you separate public and private schools and base public school classifications strictly on student population with residency requirements, you'll have schools playing on a more equal footing.

Having a few powerhouse private schools keeps the cheating public schools from having an easy path 

This doesn't make sense and it also allows private schools an unfair advantage if you're actually going to enforce residency requirements for public schools. You're calling the public schools cheats at the same time you call the private schools powerhouses. In this example, the terms "cheats" and "powerhouses" are interchangeable. 

 

[HornetFan]

1 hour ago, DarterBlue2 said:

Under current enacted state regulations, you are allowed to go to any public high school of your choice with the only caveats being that if it is not your zoned school it must not be at capacity and you must provide your own transportation. When this went into effect, the FHSAA essentially gave up on trying to police transfers (not that there were doing a stellar job prior to the change). So, until the legislature goes in a different direction, we are stuck with what we have got. 

In densely populated areas, this basically means that the great majority of talent will tend to congregate at a handful of schools.

the only caveats being that if it is not your zoned school it must not be at capacity

And, if the school is at capacity, they use a phony home address, either a relation's, a teammates, or a friend's home in that school's zone, to avoid having to go through a lottery for available slots. The sad part is that it is often done with the coach's knowledge.

[DarterBlue2]

23 minutes ago, HornetFan said:

the only caveats being that if it is not your zoned school it must not be at capacity

And, if the school is at capacity, they use a phony home address, either a relation's, a teammates, or a friend's home in that school's zone, to avoid having to go through a lottery for available slots. The sad part is that it is often done with the coach's knowledge.

Sure, some of that occurs. But having effective open enrollment subject to capacity makes it extremely difficult to police. Therefore, it is easy to get away with. Over the past 25 years which is about the length of time I have watched area football, the concentration of talent has exploded as rule changes made it easy to go wherever one wished. 

Look, to me there are legitimate reasons for kids to attend school out of zone. Three that come readily to mind are: 1. Attendance at a Magnet program related to the kid's career interests; 2. In a situation where a kid has already completed at least 2 years of high school when a new school opens up. In this situation, I feel he/she should be allowed to complete high school where they started. 3. A situation where upper level courses are not readily available to a student that that demonstrates the academic capacity to do them. 

A fourth situation that relates directly to athletics that I would consider legitimate, is if the zoned school does not offer the sport that the student wants to participate in. 

Aside from the above, I don't believe that kids should be allowed to transfer willy nilly. Athletics in general would fall into the illegitimate category unless the family actually moved into the other school zone.

[DisabledAccount]

2 hours ago, HornetFan said:

Won't happen because then you will see kids having addresses listed with 2nd or 3rd cousins or uncles to team up 

This is where coaches have to have some integrity and put a stop to allowing transfers to use phony residences. An individual that knowingly allows cheating does deserve the title of coach.

It will only further the gap between metro and rural schools who will have the flexibility to do what they want

If you separate public and private schools and base public school classifications strictly on student population with residency requirements, you'll have schools playing on a more equal footing.

Having a few powerhouse private schools keeps the cheating public schools from having an easy path 

This doesn't make sense and it also allows private schools an unfair advantage if you're actually going to enforce residency requirements for public schools. You're calling the public schools cheats at the same time you call the private schools powerhouses. In this example, the terms "cheats" and "powerhouses" are interchangeable. 

 

I wouldn't have much confidence in most programs picking honesty over winning, people are too desperate

 

 

.....

 

Columbia from a city of 10k routinely shares a district with teams from Jacksonville, a city of nearly 1M people

 

And with the scenario I mentioned above those rule changes will just make it possible for public cheaters to aquire talent through sneaky methods while we would have to fight tooth and nail for any player who wants to play here 

 

 

........

 

The difference is the publics are liars and hypocrites, the privates and schools in SFL (public or private) are open with the fact they get players

 

They don't have the media cover it up like they do up here in Jacksonville

 

[Ray Icaza]

Lots of discussion on the transfer situation, mostly focusing on Jax area and South Florida where you have large populations in confined area.  However, little mention of Dreadnaughts yet coaches in Polk know they steal players to supplement their roster every year.  They did it before the rule change and they do it now.  Their coach is held in high esteem and no doubt he knows what is going on whether legal or not; just turns a blind eye to it.  That is the model they have used to maintain their level of "Excellence"?  No matter who does it be it public or private, one cannot deny it is an unfair advantage and as was pointed out by someone in earlier discussions they helped change the rules so they could keep doing it.  Most of us are very competitive in nature and want to win terribly, but don't believe in cheating to do it.  It just cheapens the accomplishment.

[HornetFan]

16 hours ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

I wouldn't have much confidence in most programs picking honesty over winning, people are too desperate

 

 

.....

 

Columbia from a city of 10k routinely shares a district with teams from Jacksonville, a city of nearly 1M people

 

And with the scenario I mentioned above those rule changes will just make it possible for public cheaters to aquire talent through sneaky methods while we would have to fight tooth and nail for any player who wants to play here 

 

 

........

 

The difference is the publics are liars and hypocrites, the privates and schools in SFL (public or private) are open with the fact they get players

 

They don't have the media cover it up like they do up here in Jacksonville

 

I wouldn't have much confidence in most programs picking honesty over winning, people are too desperate

If the people who are running the athletic programs are so desperate that they would sacrifice their integrity in order to win a football game, they are cheating the kids on their own team by promoting dishonesty as an acceptable alternative to doing the right thing. That type of person should not be coaching or mentoring kids. 

 

[DisabledAccount]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DisabledAccount]

 

 

 

[Proseteye]

6 hours ago, HornetFan said:

I wouldn't have much confidence in most programs picking honesty over winning, people are too desperate

If the people who are running the athletic programs are so desperate that they would sacrifice their integrity in order to win a football game, they are cheating the kids on their own team by promoting dishonesty as an acceptable alternative to doing the right thing. That type of person should not be coaching or mentoring kids. 

 

Unfortunately it's not just the people running the athletic departments in these schools or even the HC. You don't think that all of the faculty, the principal, the students, to include most of the parents, don't know exactly what is going on? If they don't then they are deaf, dumb, and blind. I think they either don't give a hoot or are too afraid to say anything as long as their teams win. That is the world we live in these days. I'm quite sure there are many schools where local talent is all that is used for their teams because they care more about the students well being instead of their egos or desire to win at any cost. I am most surprised by the parochial schools that are supposed to teach morals, ethics, and fairness. Instead those religious people would rather see their own local students sit on the bench and rarely play by importing mercenaries to make the team into something they really are not. 

[skyway]

23 hours ago, Ray Icaza said:

Lots of discussion on the transfer situation, mostly focusing on Jax area and South Florida where you have large populations in confined area.  However, little mention of Dreadnaughts yet coaches in Polk know they steal players to supplement their roster every year.  They did it before the rule change and they do it now.  Their coach is held in high esteem and no doubt he knows what is going on whether legal or not; just turns a blind eye to it.  That is the model they have used to maintain their level of "Excellence"?  No matter who does it be it public or private, one cannot deny it is an unfair advantage and as was pointed out by someone in earlier discussions they helped change the rules so they could keep doing it.  Most of us are very competitive in nature and want to win terribly, but don't believe in cheating to do it.  It just cheapens the accomplishment.

How, exactly, do they "steal" players? You mean the kids leave one program to go play for them because they have a far more accomplished program? Or do you mean they are physically coercing them and/or bribing them? You seem to suggest they "cheat". In what way are they cheating? I seem to remember not too long ago others demanding "proof" for such accusations.

[DisabledAccount]

 

 

 

[DisabledAccount]

Yulee lost themselves a OL to Bolles but unreported by the Jacksonville media so here's the kids Hudl instead

 

https://www.hudl.com/profile/13135266/Brendan-Black

 

 

[Perspective]

8 hours ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Yulee lost themselves a OL to Bolles but unreported by the Jacksonville media so here's the kids Hudl instead

 

https://www.hudl.com/profile/13135266/Brendan-Black

 

 

ColumbiaFan, I know that Jacksonville transfers (especially into public schools) is a topic near and dear to your heart.  But, I don't know if the media should be blamed for not reporting it, as if it's some kind of conspiracy between the media and the schools in Duval Co.  

In the Tampa Bay area, we've gone from two daily publications to one and home delivery has gone from 7 days a week to 2.  During football season, the newspapers used to have stories on virtually every game in the area.  Now, they tend to pick out two or three games, cover only those games, and nothing is said about all the others (not even scores).  We see absolutely zero coverage of high school football during the off-season.  Occasionally, one of the beat writers will retweet something, but that's about it.  And the TV stations are really no better.   During the season, one of the stations does a "high school windup" in the last 5-10 minutes of it's 11:00 newscast on Friday nights, but as with the print media, they focus on 4-5 games, if that, show a handful of highlights, and give a handful of scores. 

I mention all of this because the media, and the media's coverage of high school football, in particular, and high school sports, in general, has changed (and by "changed," I mean "decreased") considerably over the years as the whole media landscape has changed because of the Internet.  Personally, I don't like it, but I reluctantly understand it. 

My point is this:  the media has fewer and fewer resources and they are unlikely to devote those resources to someone whose main job it is to keep track of high school kids jumping from one ship to another.   Fortunately, as represented by the several posts you have included on this thread, there are some people in some areas (like South Florida) that do track transfers and who post the information.  (By the way, as an aside, and based on what I've seen in this thread, is Hallandale even going to be able to field a team this year?   Seems like every other kid I've seen is transferring from Hallandale to another school.). 

Bottom line:  if there were tens of thousands of people in a metro area who were interested in the fact that some 11th grade kid announced on his Twitter feed that he was transferring from one school to another, the media would report it.  But there aren't, so they don't.