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Longtime Observer last won the day on May 9
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: 2001 6A Title Game - Northwestern v Apopka
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nolebull813 reacted to a post in a topic: 2001 6A Title Game - Northwestern v Apopka
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2001 6A Title Game - Northwestern v Apopka
Longtime Observer replied to OldSchoolLion's topic in The Huddle
Here is the full film: Year of the Bull -
Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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nolebull813 reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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Haha. Second-best win in Bartow history. I was present for the top win in their history, on a cold afternoon in Daytona Beach in 1996
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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No doubt the 1984 win over Manatee remains one of the top 10-20 wins in Lakeland history, and at the time it was the biggest win. Tying it back into Panhandle programs, Lakeland ended up getting beaten by two TDs by Pensacola Woodham...who then beat Miami Southridge by two TDs for the state title.
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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It's amazing how much more emphasis the 1993 state title game has received than the far more compelling 1994 title game. My comments were just meant to pay respect towards the historical successes of panhandle schools. But, Manatee also got the short end of the stick as well. Manatee has state-title winning outcomes vs. Miami Southridge, Miami Carol City and Fort Lauderdale Dillard (and many other big wins over Dade and Broward schools outside of state title games) and yet the ONLY game you still hear about is the 1993 game. The typical message board pundit knows all about the 1993 game, while being totally oblivious to those 1983, 1989, 1992 or 1994 games.
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MarkECannon reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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Now that I'm all the way down this rabbit hole, let me confirm for those wondering: 1994 Southridge's record entering the state title game: 14-0 Head coach Don Soldinger RBs: Darren Davis and Sedrick Irvin.
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Are we really to believe that the talent in Dade county in 1994 was waayyyy down? Of course not. The talent was just much more diluted or diffuse then, due to attendance boundaries being enforced much more.
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Just went back and verified that Miami Southridge was not only unbeaten and defending state champs in 1994 (with everyone drooling over and obsessed with their win over Manatee in 1993), they were ranked number one in the country by USA Today (the gold standard for national rankings then). Washington, on the other hand, was 1-9 the previous season and failed to win their district in 1994! They then beat that Southridge team by two scores. Watch the full game here
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Oh, sure, they're all trying at this point. There are just several factors that have kept anyone from totally running the area. Niceville is an hour plus from Pensacola. They've gotten some kids from there I'm sure. Just not enough. Niceville lost to Mosley and had a pretty competitive win vs. Choctaw, so it's unlikely Niceville had that much of a monopoly on local talent last season. Now, if we start seeing them easily running-clock all of the other teams in the area, then we'd have reason to look closer and see if they have gotten most all of the best players. The panhandle schools did very well historically when the top schools never had more than one or two transfers. Anyone can see this if they check the record books. In 1980, Cantonment Tate beat Miami Columbus- necessarily the best team in Dade that year as no other Dade school played for a title in any class- in the large school state title game, 35-7. In 1982, Pensacola Woodham beat Columbus in the same large class title game, 23-14. In 1984, Woodham beat Miami Southridge for the big school title. In 1991, Fort Walton Beach dominated STA 39-14 for a state title. In 1994, Pensacola Washington beat undefeated and reigning state champion Miami Southridge by two scores. There are also many seasons in which no Dade team played for a state title because all the schools were knocked off in early rounds by a school in a different county. You'd be abosultely crazy and wrong to allege that there weren't a TON of great players in Dade county in the 1980s and 1990s. Dade was the most talent-rich county in the country in those years, too. The difference, of course, was that transfer mania wasn't a thing. And, while the stronger programs no doubt got a key transfer here or there, for the most part the rosters were dictated by narrow attendance boundaries.
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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They certainly could produce a state power that hangs with anyone in the state. But, in the current climate, that would require one program to compile most of the top talent. And that area has seen many schools have great teams, but no one school that can lay claim to being head and shoulders over others. And, I think the culture of that area is more traditional or less keen on the new age transfer mania. Perhaps the strongest program in the broader area, Niceville, is too far from Pensacola to attract enough players from there to become good enough to beat a mega power. The sad thing is, nothing said above means the quality of football is less in that area. They just aren't trying to build all-star teams built on attracting players from far and wide. If the variables were reversed, and Pensacola had a program that went "all-in" on monopolizing local talent, while Dade/Broward schools were somehow forced to strictly use players within a small set of boundaries (like it was in, say, the 1980s), then the Pensacola powerhouse would dominate the Dade and Broward teams. You'd still have a completely uneven playing field, but now that uneven field would work for the Pensacola team and against the Dade and Broward teams. Of course, in current reality, things are reversed from my hypothetical.
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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You can interpret the results in the same way. I promise you no school is putting their team on buses to play a major state power so they can get the backups some practice etc.
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Longtime Observer reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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topnotch305 reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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Just announced that Miami Northwestern will face Lakeland Aug. 16 at 7pm at...Vero Beach High. So, a somewhat middle ground for each. Weird venue to be sure!
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Dr. D reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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It woudn't have to be strictly tied to counties. Just general regional areas. The number of programs would depend on the level of interest and number of players in a given area. Dade/broward area might have 5+ programs, while Polk/Heartland might have 1-2, for example. The key phrase you mention in deciding what game to attend is "my local school". This seems to be more about them being the local program, rather than it being your alma mater. This would still be an option for you, as the idea is to have higher caliber programs that represent a geographic area. You'd root for your local team against a strong team from another area. All of the players on your local team are from your area, though they can attend a variety of schools for academics. A Manatee county program can appeal to all of the residents of Manatee county, including those who may have attended historically poor programs when they were at each individual school. Now, if Bayshore is your high school, you're basically frozen out of having a team to root for that can win. It's been that way for decades. Manatee (and Southeast back in the day) have been so dominant that it's got to be hard to get excited to even a tiny degree. Because a form of what I propose already exists to a lesser, informal extent, the lower level programs are actually much worse now than the past. Bayshore failed to score a single point in eight (8) games last year. How many fans attended their games? Contrast that with the number of people who'd like to support the program if it was ever a little bit close to mattering. I bet there's plenty of folks who'd be willing to invest time/money, but are abstaining because it is hopeless. Sharply reducing the number of programs as I propose allows all of the folks in the Bradenton area to unite around 1 strong team. Everyone is included, regardless of where academic classes occur. Each Friday night would see the Manatee county area program face another strong program from another area. For example, the Manatee elite program vs. East Hillsborough elite one week. Another week, Manatee vs. Sarasota elite. Etc. All the best players, coaches and all in the community who want a team to root for are consolidated. Ticket sales, booster contributions and other investments are consolidated into a much smaller number of elite programs. You see this to a small degree in a place like Texas, where there are fewer but larger high schools with mega support. Allen High, for example, is known for having massive, super impressive facilities. But, Allen High has over 5,000 students! They could've very easily split that up into three high schools. And then all three would be smaller, with potential stars and donors diluted to the point that none of the three programs offer anything remotely close to what the huge Allen High offers now. At a super large school, everything end up being bigger or more robust. Academically, many feel that comes with trade-off costs. So, it may not be the case that super large schools are best overall for students. BUT, when it comes to sports programs, the benefits are obvious. If you separate schools from mega, for-profit sports programs, school enrollment doesn't matter any more. A Manatee county area super program pulling in fans from all over the area, could be something very special. Of course, they'd face special programs from other areas as well. So, the quality of play would be better. Also, with fewer programs in this super league, the need for officials is also less. This should lead to cutting the worst performing officials and eliminate the shortage we face currently. I've never gotten the impression that AAU teams were tied to geographic areas and regional pride. And, the AAU championships have never been seen as THE championships. They're also held in summer, when folks aren't paying attention to basketball. But, sure, considerations around how to avoid making such a league another kind of AAU thing would be important.
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First, high school wrestling, to my limited knowledge, is not at a big-time, big $ level like football and basketball. So, I don't think that comparison works for what I'm talking about. I'm not opposed to schools offering sports as extracurriculars per se. If we return to football, perhaps we could use my alma mater as an example. What you've said about Brandon wrestling can mostly be said for Lakeland football. So, under my plan, Lakeland High school no longer offers a football program operating at anywhere near the financial level it is now. It would be a club sport, if they fielded a team of any kind at all. What effect would that have on the football players in Polk county? It would almost certainly be a benefit. As is mostly already the case, kids zoned for all sorts of different schools play football for Lakeland. It's an attempt at a...regional all-star team. There would absolutely be one or two Polk/regional all-star programs existing. What would be gone are the dysfunctional programs already lacking support. This would lead to a consolidation of resources such that the exisiting major programs have more $ invested, better coaches and fan support. The kids see themselves as representing Polk county, and not a particular school, anyway.
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And this helps to underscore the reality that K-12 SCHOOLS should be completely separate from big-time, for-profit sports. In truth, they already are in every way but the official way. Make big-time, for-profit sports REGIONAL rather than attached to K-12 schools.
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topnotch305 reacted to a post in a topic: KICKOFF Classics must see games
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I think we can count on the game "counting" as far as both trying their best to win. If MNW blows Lakeland out, I promise I won't switch up and pretend they didn't try! It's also going to be a really good "gate" for an 11th non-playoff game. Hope the crowd is big!