The WORST team to have on your schedule the rest of the season?

[Perspective]

53 minutes ago, nolebull813 said:

 They focus on international players. 

 

So, I ask my question again:  how are they 'focusing' on international players?  How are kids from around the globe finding out about and developing an interest in attending CAI?  I'm genuinely curious.  

[nolebull813]

13 minutes ago, Perspective said:

So, I ask my question again:  how are they 'focusing' on international players?  How are kids from around the globe finding out about and developing an interest in attending CAI?  I'm genuinely curious.  

It’s mainly Canadian kids. I’m sure there are affiliates in Canada but I’m not sure. Maybe they travel to these countries and pitch their program. Not sure. Plus we live in the Information Age where it wouldn’t be that hard to find out about them. Especially since they been doing it for years now. If a kid comes from Italy, Germany, France etc and makes it big in regards to going D1 then I’m sure that is big news back home: Those kids are probably popular and are followed by a lot of people on social media back home, and those kids pave the way for the new ones. 

[nolebull813]

Excellent article from 2019

 

https://theathletic.com/1113371/2019/08/05/college-football-recruiting-clearwater-international-academy-ajou-ajou-clemson/?amp=1

[nolebull813]

Here is more on how they built their program from the ground up

https://www.clearwateracademy.org/student-life/athletics/football/

[Perspective]

46 minutes ago, nolebull813 said:

The people criticizing them usually don’t know one thing about the school or even met someone with firsthand knowledge that can testify on their behalf. Just internet rumors, message board goobers, and trolls who can’t handle anything other than the status quo. And for the life of me I will never understand why someone making a decision that’s best for them and their family upsets random obscure strangers who have no skin in the game 

Nolebull,

Here's my perspective.   I don't have any problem with kids/families making decisions that are best for them and best for their futures.  Quite frankly, every parent should be doing everything within their power/control/means to create the best opportunities for their kids - whether they play sports or not. 

But, when it comes time to start talking about high school sports, teams should be on an even playing field when it comes to the rules that each school must play by.  Over time, certain schools will flourish because of a multitude of factors (coaching, athletic talent of the kids who attend a particular school, amenities, past success, etc.) and other schools will fail.   If the schools are not playing by the same rules, they ought not to be competing against each other for the same rewards.

I know very little about CAI.  However, just like when IMG started playing football, I have great difficulty comprehending how or why a large number of athletically-inclined kids from around the globe all of a sudden decide to start attending this small school (250 kids in K-12) in Clearwater, Florida that, oh, by the way, has visible ties to a "church" or "religion" that has been under scrutiny for quite some time (i.e. Scientology).  How does this happen without someone, somehow, aggressively pursuing these kids in a way that likely violates FHSAA rules? 

Again, I don't blame the kids or their families for trying to do what's best for them. And if attending CAI is what's best, that's what they should do.   My problem is not with kids and their families.  My problem is with schools that don't play by the rules. 

[nolebull813]

9 minutes ago, Perspective said:

Nolebull,

Here's my perspective.   I don't have any problem with kids/families making decisions that are best for them and best for their futures.  Quite frankly, every parent should be doing everything within their power/control/means to create the best opportunities for their kids - whether they play sports or not. 

But, when it comes time to start talking about high school sports, teams should be on an even playing field when it comes to the rules that each school must play by.  Over time, certain schools will flourish because of a multitude of factors (coaching, athletic talent of the kids who attend a particular school, amenities, past success, etc.) and other schools will fail.   If the schools are not playing by the same rules, they ought not to be competing against each other for the same rewards.

I know very little about CAI.  However, just like when IMG started playing football, I have great difficulty comprehending how or why a large number of athletically-inclined kids from around the globe all of a sudden decide to start attending this small school (250 kids in K-12) in Clearwater, Florida that, oh, by the way, has visible ties to a "church" or "religion" that has been under scrutiny for quite some time (i.e. Scientology).  How does this happen without someone, somehow, aggressively pursuing these kids in a way that likely violates FHSAA rules? 

Again, I don't blame the kids or their families for trying to do what's best for them. And if attending CAI is what's best, that's what they should do.   My problem is not with kids and their families.  My problem is with schools that don't play by the rules. 

They are not associated with the FHSAA in any way 

[Perspective]

11 minutes ago, nolebull813 said:

Excellent article from 2019

 

https://theathletic.com/1113371/2019/08/05/college-football-recruiting-clearwater-international-academy-ajou-ajou-clemson/?amp=1

Agreed.  Excellent article.   Explains a lot. 

Two things that jump out at me:  first, it appears that there is a guy up in Canada "sending" kids down to CAI.   That could be problematic.  Second, housing is being provided for the football players.  Arguably, housing is being provided for all international students . . . but if my math is right, approximately 20% of the entire 250-student population are international students.  That's about 50 kids.   The football team has 46 kids on their roster (per MaxPreps).  Now, not all of the kids who play football are international, but perhaps the majority are?  All I know is that the FHSAA has come down hard on schools in the past if they find out that kids  who play football are living with non-family members (a la The Blind Side). 

In any event, it appears that CAI has carved out a nice little niche and kids from elsewhere (primarily Canada) who might not otherwise get noticed are getting the opportunity to go to college for free.  That's great for those kids.   And I'll leave it at that. 

[Perspective]

13 minutes ago, nolebull813 said:

They are not associated with the FHSAA in any way 

So, if they're not associated with the FHSAA and they don't have to play by FHSAA rules, why are they playing teams that are associated and do play by FHSAA rules?   If memory serves me correct, when a Florida team wants to play an out-of-state game, they can only play against teams that are part of an official state athletic association.   Why is it any different for playing a team in state?

So, CAI can recruit.  They can provide housing for athletes.  They don't have to meet academic requirements.  There is no age limit.  Essentially, it's a remote Canadian all-star team playing down here where the weather is nice and playing against teams that can't do any of those things.   So how does a game against CAI factor into another teams power index/ranking?

Serious question:  can Bradford High School schedule a game against the Raiford Prison All-Star Team (it would probably need to be an away game for BHS)? 

[nolebull813]

1 hour ago, Perspective said:

So, if they're not associated with the FHSAA and they don't have to play by FHSAA rules, why are they playing teams that are associated and do play by FHSAA rules?   If memory serves me correct, when a Florida team wants to play an out-of-state game, they can only play against teams that are part of an official state athletic association.   Why is it any different for playing a team in state?

So, CAI can recruit.  They can provide housing for athletes.  They don't have to meet academic requirements.  There is no age limit.  Essentially, it's a remote Canadian all-star team playing down here where the weather is nice and playing against teams that can't do any of those things.   So how does a game against CAI factor into another teams power index/ranking?

Serious question:  can Bradford High School schedule a game against the Raiford Prison All-Star Team (it would probably need to be an away game for BHS)? 

I believe some politicians passed a law years back stating that the FHSAA can’t ban their member schools from playing independent Florida teams. 
 

The real question you should be asking is how is IMG a sanctioned member of the FHSAA when they openly recruit and board kids for the sole purpose to play high school football. 

[PinellasFB]

10 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

By “not a legitimate high school” do you mean their credits don’t count towards what the Florida department of education would describe as a high school diploma? 

By "not legitimate" I mean that their primary goals are not education like the focus of all schools should be.  Some illegitimate private schools, for example, are just for profit and were created just to collect that private school voucher from the state, using athletic scholarships as their primary means for doing so.  Now CAI is especially suspect because their primary focus is to promote Scientology (despite their secular mission statements) because we ALL KNOW that scientology is extremely secretive and and is extremely interested in promoting itself to recruit new members, especially ones that can pay up.  Having high performing sports teams is one way of attracting attention to your weird little school.  

[nolebull813]

1 minute ago, PinellasFB said:

By "not legitimate" I mean that their primary goals are not education like the focus of all schools should be.  Some illegitimate private schools, for example, are just for profit and were created just to collect that private school voucher from the state, using athletic scholarships as their primary means for doing so.  Now CAI is especially suspect because their primary focus is to promote Scientology (despite their secular mission statements) because we ALL KNOW that scientology is extremely secretive and and is extremely interested in promoting itself to recruit new members, especially ones that can pay up.  Having high performing sports teams is one way of attracting attention to your weird little school.  

Have you heard any coach or player espouse views that would be in line or even be taken as advocating or promoting Scientology? 

[PinellasFB]

1 minute ago, nolebull813 said:

Have you heard any coach or player espouse views that would be in line or even be taken as advocating or promoting Scientology? 

Dude, I am talking about the school itself.  Coaches and players are there to play football. There probably isn't even a single scientologist on the team.  They are being used for a purpose by that school, which is what my point is.  In the end, it is mutually beneficial so I can't call these kids exploited but that doesn't make the school any more legitimate.

[nolebull813]

8 minutes ago, PinellasFB said:

Dude, I am talking about the school itself.  Coaches and players are there to play football. There probably isn't even a single scientologist on the team.  They are being used for a purpose by that school, which is what my point is.  In the end, it is mutually beneficial so I can't call these kids exploited but that doesn't make the school any more legitimate.

The level of legitimacy you place on them is simply an opinion that can’t be corroborated with facts. If the way they attract kids to the school is something you find unorthodox then it just means you don’t agree with it or understand it,  but that doesn’t make it illegitimate. 
 

You know what is illegitimate? An F rated failing public school with a high drop out rate and barely any kids going to college. 

[Perspective]

1 hour ago, nolebull813 said:

The real question you should be asking is how is IMG a sanctioned member of the FHSAA when they openly recruit and board kids for the sole purpose to play high school football. 

I have asked that question many times (on this site and others).   It just doesn't make sense to me. 

[nolebull813]

25 minutes ago, Perspective said:

I have asked that question many times (on this site and others).   It just doesn't make sense to me. 

The hypocrisy does not go unnoticed. One of the many reasons you cant take the FHSAA seriously 

[THAT S--T WAS FUNNY]

1 hour ago, nolebull813 said:

The hypocrisy does not go unnoticed. One of the many reasons you cant take the FHSAA seriously 

Aint that the damn TRUTH

[Longtime Observer]

14 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

By “not a legitimate high school” do you mean their credits don’t count towards what the Florida department of education would describe as a high school diploma? 

The "school" doesn't exist to educate young people between the ages of ~14 and ~18. It exists solely as a football academy, with an emphasis on international players. You remove the football program, and there quite literally is no more CAI.

[Longtime Observer]

8 hours ago, Dr. D said:

We're not talking about a Bishop Sycamore here, as among other things, this school was founded in 1984 and has an actual campus.  They have gone to a lot of trouble with their website, if this is an "illegitimate" operation:  https://www.clearwateracademy.org/.   Hard to believe parents would be paying $13,345 tuition if their diploma wouldn't get them into a college or university.  Do all the athletes at STA ($14,750) and C-M ($16,300) pay tuition?  I would call CAI a "non-traditional" school, but not sure that is a bad thing for certain students whose needs can't be met by the public school system.  

It seems that taxpayer dollars, through vouchers, are helping to pay for...international football players to attend. So, it seems exceedingly unlikely they are doing much to help "students whose needs can't be met by the public school system".

[Longtime Observer]

For the record, I'm agnostic on the question of whether a school like this is good or bad. But, I do think we need to be honest about what they are, and what they are not. And, I'm not sure the politicians or voters who approve of private school vouchers approve of intentionally giving them to international students who otherwise would never show up anywhere near the state of Florida for school. 

[Dr. D]

Technically, our taxpayer dollars are being used for Florida residents in the form of the state voucher program.  International students would not be eligible by state law to be given vouchers "intentionally".  SInce CAI has been open since 1984, and didn't start football until 2009, it is debatable whether the school would cease to exist without the football program. 

[nolebull813]

10 hours ago, Longtime Observer said:

The "school" doesn't exist to educate young people between the ages of ~14 and ~18. It exists solely as a football academy, with an emphasis on international players. You remove the football program, and there quite literally is no more CAI.

Didn’t someone just post they have been a school since 1984 and only have an 11 man football team for the last 10 years? Unless they were about to go under before football saved them then I don’t think that would have been the case 

[Jambun82]

17 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

The level of legitimacy you place on them is simply an opinion that can’t be corroborated with facts. If the way they attract kids to the school is something you find unorthodox then it just means you don’t agree with it or understand it,  but that doesn’t make it illegitimate. 
 

You know what is illegitimate? An F rated failing public school with a high drop out rate and barely any kids going to college. 

These are great points. I am not sure why grown adults are so threatened by these arrangements, especially since these teams cannot compete for FHSAA playoffs and no FHSAA team is required to play them. 

[PinellasFB]

18 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

The level of legitimacy you place on them is simply an opinion that can’t be corroborated with facts. If the way they attract kids to the school is something you find unorthodox then it just means you don’t agree with it or understand it,  but that doesn’t make it illegitimate. 
 

You know what is illegitimate? An F rated failing public school with a high drop out rate and barely any kids going to college. 

Okay man, we will agree to disagree on this one.  You spout on about my lack of facts (fair enough) but you don't throw any facts out yourself to defend them.  Simply having a great football team doesn't make the school legit either.  I find them highly suspect based upon circumstances of extremely small enrollment and sudden investment in football but on the other hand they aren't any different than IMG which most folks seem okay with.

As far as F rated schools, that is a completely different topic based upon public school funding and local neighborhood socioeconomics.  In fact, public money (via vouchers) going to these private schools is money that could be flowing into these F rated schools.  At least I agree with you here in that this needs to be addressed.  It's a tough solution and I don't really know how to fix it because it is much deeper than simply throwing money at the problem.

[Perspective]

20 hours ago, Perspective said:

So how does a game against CAI factor into another teams power index/ranking?

I'm separating this question out from a prior post to see if anyone knows the answer.  Is CAI treated like any other school for purposes of ranking FHSAA teams?

[nolebull813]

29 minutes ago, PinellasFB said:

Okay man, we will agree to disagree on this one.  You spout on about my lack of facts (fair enough) but you don't throw any facts out yourself to defend them.  Simply having a great football team doesn't make the school legit either.  I find them highly suspect based upon circumstances of extremely small enrollment and sudden investment in football but on the other hand they aren't any different than IMG which most folks seem okay with.

As far as F rated schools, that is a completely different topic based upon public school funding and local neighborhood socioeconomics.  In fact, public money (via vouchers) going to these private schools is money that could be flowing into these F rated schools.  At least I agree with you here in that this needs to be addressed.  It's a tough solution and I don't really know how to fix it because it is much deeper than simply throwing money at the problem.

They were a school decades before they had a football team. At what point did they need a football team to survive as a school?