Lakeland 50 Kathleen 0

[LakelandGator]

4 hours ago, FL_HS_football said:

You realize the combined record of the teams Lakeland has played since Apopka is 26-39, they've really loaded up the schedule with some power houses there to pad that stellar defense stats you want to promote so badly.....lets face it they beat what will be a 6-4 Manatee after this week and that hasnt beat a single team that will make the playoffs; An Apopka team that could also very easily end up 6-4 after the week and lost last week 35-0......yeap the same team that scored 20 points on that stellar Lakelend defense your touting, couldnt score a single point this past week? These are the teams that you want to  point to as statement games, that says Lakeland is a 2018 state title contender?

You know so much about Lakeland, so you think, but out of curiosity which team do you represent or support?

[DisabledAccount]

40 minutes ago, LakelandGator said:

According to whom?

Anyone can look at 7a right now and know that St Thomas Aquinas isn't the only threat to Lakeland this year 

 

[Hwy17]

13 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Anyone can look at 7a right now and know that St Thomas Aquinas isn't the only threat to Lakeland this year 

 

Lakeland is region 2, biggest threat in my opinion is Plant.  

Region 1 - I expect a Columbia vs Lee rematch.  

[OldSchoolLion]

For what it's worth...go back in FHSAA history and you will find numerous teams that had pedestrian schedules(by today's standards) and won state titles.  There seems to be a belief today that having a "strong" schedule is critical to prepare a team for the playoffs.  That may or may not be true, depending upon the team.   It is less critical for a balanced, seasoned team(ie upperclassmen who have playoff experience) with a seasoned coach.   

For example, Armwood won the 4A state title in 2003.  In 2004, their regular season opponents had a combined regular season record of 22-47.  They demolished Countryside, Mariner and MIddleton in the playoffs before facing Booker T Washington in the state semifinals.  Nobody had gotten within 21 points of Armwood before that game.  They had a very seasoned team and coach, and they beat BTW.  By the way, BTW's regular season opponents had a 38-37 record that year...easy by today's standards.  BTW had a great coach named Ice Harris.  No doubt those were two of the better teams in the state that year, and I am confident they were capable of beating anyone on a given day despite their "weak" schedules.

We are obsessed with scheduling today.  Folks today would laugh at the schedules of long ago.  Scheduling sometimes becomes the scapegoat for a team's playoff performance when the real culprit is poor execution and mental preparedness for a playoff game.  Playing a tough schedule can help certain teams, but it is not a necessity for all.  In fact, it could hinder a team's playoff hopes if they sustain injuries.  As someone said in a prior post, some particularly talented teams get excellent experience in their practices alone.      

[DisabledAccount]

9 minutes ago, Hwy17 said:

Lakeland is region 2, biggest threat in my opinion is Plant.  

Region 1 - I expect a Columbia vs Lee rematch.  

Don't sleep on viera,  they have really started to improve as year went on

 

And yeah it seems region 1 could come down to those 2 at some point (most likely second round)

[Hwy17]

24 minutes ago, OldSchoolLion said:

For what it's worth...go back in FHSAA history and you will find numerous teams that had pedestrian schedules(by today's standards) and won state titles.  There seems to be a belief today that having a "strong" schedule is critical to prepare a team for the playoffs.  That may or may not be true, depending upon the team.   It is less critical for a balanced, seasoned team(ie upperclassmen who have playoff experience) with a seasoned coach.   

For example, Armwood won the 4A state title in 2003.  In 2004, their regular season opponents had a combined regular season record of 22-47.  They demolished Countryside, Mariner and MIddleton in the playoffs before facing Booker T Washington in the state semifinals.  Nobody had gotten within 21 points of Armwood before that game.  They had a very seasoned team and coach, and they beat BTW.  By the way, BTW's regular season opponents had a 38-37 record that year...easy by today's standards.  BTW had a great coach named Ice Harris.  No doubt those were two of the better teams in the state that year, and I am confident they were capable of beating anyone on a given day despite their "weak" schedules.

We are obsessed with scheduling today.  Folks today would laugh at the schedules of long ago.  Scheduling sometimes becomes the scapegoat for a team's playoff performance when the real culprit is poor execution and mental preparedness for a playoff game.  Playing a tough schedule can help certain teams, but it is not a necessity for all.  In fact, it could hinder a team's playoff hopes if they sustain injuries.  As someone said in a prior post, some particularly talented teams get excellent experience in their practices alone.      

I think playing competition that will give you a good challenge does more that scheduling a program you have no chance of beating and getting a running clock put on you.  This is what I told some Southeast fans pertaining to them playing Manatee and getting killed every year.  I said they would be better off scheduling other good 4a-5a teams until they get back on track.

Likewise, playing too weak of a schedule doesn't help either.  Sebring for example: They have the talent to be a top program, but the big fish in small pond mentality holds them back. They get beat bad in the playoffs because their schedule is way too soft for what they should be playing.  When they go up against a good team, they don't know what to do.  

One thing I don't like about this point system - take Lake Placid or Bayshore as examples; these programs have been losers for a long time but trying to change that.  They have both scheduled non-district games they can win and as a result, have some wins to show for it.  However they don't have enough points to make the playoffs.  They could have more points to show if they played teams they can't beat and get running clocked rather than playing the teams they can beat and getting a win.  

[gwdrum75]

The one thing I'll say about scheduling......

Scheduling can be a hit or miss proposition. Two years ago, when this contract cycle was created, Lakeland added Manatee, East Lake, Apopka & Gibbs.

Gibbs - Definitely not a strong team. But, at that time was 1 year removed from being in the playoffs.

Manatee - At that time, looked to be on the way back up. Then, their coach left after Spring ball and have been on a rebuild since.

East Lake - Coming off a 9-2 season and looked to be a quality 7A opponent.

Apopka - Two years removed from a state championship, and 10-2, 10-1 previous two years records.

While I am not 100% satisfied with Lakeland's schedule, it's hard to say they didn't at least attempt to get some tougher competition on there. Is it their fault that those teams have not lived up to their expectations?

[OldSchoolLion]

10 minutes ago, gwdrum75 said:

The one thing I'll say about scheduling......

Scheduling can be a hit or miss proposition. Two years ago, when this contract cycle was created, Lakeland added Manatee, East Lake, Apopka & Gibbs.

Gibbs - Definitely not a strong team. But, at that time was 1 year removed from being in the playoffs.

Manatee - At that time, looked to be on the way back up. Then, their coach left after Spring ball and have been on a rebuild since.

East Lake - Coming off a 9-2 season and looked to be a quality 7A opponent.

Apopka - Two years removed from a state championship, and 10-2, 10-1 previous two years records.

While I am not 100% satisfied with Lakeland's schedule, it's hard to say they didn't at least attempt to get some tougher competition on there. Is it their fault that those teams have not lived up to their expectations?

With the coaching carousel and player transfers of today, things have gotten even more complicated.  And with smaller districts, one must roll the dice (in terms of selecting opponents) more than in the past.  Someone could end up with a much tougher or much easier schedule than one expected.  It must be very frustrating.    

[FL_HS_football]

4 hours ago, Hwy17 said:

Lakeland is region 2, biggest threat in my opinion is Plant.  

Region 1 - I expect a Columbia vs Lee rematch.  

The statement above is exactly why I made comment of your poll last week, as you completely dismissed Viera and it just illustrates once again any real lack of knowledge of teams beyond what you see with an over-all record. Oh by the way how'd Cardinal Mooney make out last week? Still have them over ranked.............

[FL_HS_football]

6 hours ago, LakelandGator said:

You know so much about Lakeland, so you think, but out of curiosity which team do you represent or support?

 

 

I just support Florida high school football statewide....(seen alot of Lakeland High school football too, going all the way back to the 70's).

[LakelandGator]

5 hours ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

Anyone can look at 7a right now and know that St Thomas Aquinas isn't the only threat to Lakeland this year 

 

And anyone with a lick of football knowledge knows Sta wasn't the only threat before.

USA #1 team Lakeland went to Niceville and left with a 28-21 regional final win.

Since you're obviously propping up NorthFL, which team in your lifetime would have won that( late November @Niceville). And what north FL team beats Mainland '04 or '06?

[LakelandGator]

7 hours ago, FL_HS_football said:

Just off the cuff, I'd say STA were the only thing during that 2004-2006 run, that stood between Lakeland and a state title.

And you would be wrong, again.

[OldSchoolLion]

17 minutes ago, LakelandGator said:

And anyone with a lick of football knowledge knows Sta wasn't the only threat before.

USA #1 team Lakeland went to Niceville and left with a 28-21 regional final win.

Since you're obviously propping up NorthFL, which team in your lifetime would have won that( late November @Niceville). And what north FL team beats Mainland '04 or '06?

Mainland was very tough those years.  Saw them play.  In 06, they played Lakeland well in the state semis...19-14 Lakeland at halftime and Mainland was within a TD in the fourth quarter before Rainey broke one off late in the fourth quarter.

[Hwy17]

44 minutes ago, FL_HS_football said:

The statement above is exactly why I made comment of your poll last week, as you completely dismissed Viera and it just illustrates once again any real lack of knowledge of teams beyond what you see with an over-all record. Oh by the way how'd Cardinal Mooney make out last week? Still have them over ranked.............

That poll only includes an 8 county subset.  

Sure, Cardinal Mooney lost. But it was to an opponent I ranked higher.  They dropped in this week's poll.

Viera: other than a good playoff run in 2015 what has been their accomplishment?

[DisabledAccount]

32 minutes ago, LakelandGator said:

And anyone with a lick of football knowledge knows Sta wasn't the only threat before.

USA #1 team Lakeland went to Niceville and left with a 28-21 regional final win.

Since you're obviously propping up NorthFL, which team in your lifetime would have won that( late November @Niceville). And what north FL team beats Mainland '04 or '06?

Which year was this niceville game? 

[LakelandGator]

51 minutes ago, OldSchoolLion said:

Mainland was very tough those years.  Saw them play.  In 06, they played Lakeland well in the state semis...19-14 Lakeland at halftime and Mainland was within a TD in the fourth quarter before Rainey broke one off late in the fourth quarter.

Once again you nailed it.

Mainland took apart north FL's best and gave Lakeland fits. I stood along the Bucs sideline, they were very, very confident. The friday night atmosphere @Bryant Stadium can be pretty intimidating.

If star QB Jonathan Garner(Georgia Tech recruit) doesnt get hurt early in the game, the outcome could have been different.

But yeah there were only 2 decent teams back then.

[954gator]

1 hour ago, LakelandGator said:

And anyone with a lick of football knowledge knows Sta wasn't the only threat before.

USA #1 team Lakeland went to Niceville and left with a 28-21 regional final win.

Since you're obviously propping up NorthFL, which team in your lifetime would have won that( late November @Niceville). And what north FL team beats Mainland '04 or '06?

This...so this. 

[FL_HS_football]

2 hours ago, LakelandGator said:

And anyone with a lick of football knowledge knows Sta wasn't the only threat before.

USA #1 team Lakeland went to Niceville and left with a 28-21 regional final win.

which team in your lifetime would have won that( late November @Niceville). ?

1994 - Manatee as a district runner-up travels to play district champion Lakeland and beats them with a back-up tailback, then travels to an play an undefeated top ranked Apopka and beats them. Then goes in late November to play 10-1 district Champion Niceville at Niceville......guess what Manatee wins! So winning at Niceville in late November isn't all that great of an accomplishment.....(at least not in the Lakeland bias narrative you would have us all believe)...........it happens and Manatee wasn't even the eventual state champ that year. 

[LakelandGator]

Hey genius, I'm pretty sure we were talking about that north FL(Jax/LC)region he's pumping up. Which teams in "his" lifetime, in that region.

Any map you can find would disqualify the Canes. Just a guess on my part

And I would love to hear Manatee folk say that 1 point W in the panhandle wasn't a big deal, you don't count.

[OldSchoolLion]

1 hour ago, LakelandGator said:

Once again you nailed it.

Mainland took apart north FL's best and gave Lakeland fits. I stood along the Bucs sideline, they were very, very confident. The friday night atmosphere @Bryant Stadium can be pretty intimidating.

If star QB Jonathan Garner(Georgia Tech recruit) doesnt get hurt early in the game, the outcome could have been different.

But yeah there were only 2 decent teams back then.

The state semi and final were held in Niceville in 1988.  Niceville won that year by trouncing Bradenton SE 48-14.  It took 17 years for Niceville to make it back to a state semi...the game with Lakeland at Niceville in 2005.  That place had to be rocking.  Coach Castle commented afterward how tough it was to win in that atmosphere and how physical Niceville was.  Apparently Niceville played very inspired football that night.  They drove the ball down the field in the closing minutes and were only a few yards from scoring when time ran out.  

If Bill Castle says it was a tough place to win that year, it was a tough place to win.  I applaud any team that travels that far away from home and wins. 

[gwdrum75]

13 hours ago, OldSchoolLion said:

Mainland was very tough those years.  Saw them play.  In 06, they played Lakeland well in the state semis...19-14 Lakeland at halftime and Mainland was within a TD in the fourth quarter before Rainey broke one off late in the fourth quarter.

 

[DisabledAccount]

10 hours ago, LakelandGator said:

Hey genius, I'm pretty sure we were talking about that north FL(Jax/LC)region he's pumping up. Which teams in "his" lifetime, in that region.

Any map you can find would disqualify the Canes. Just a guess on my part

And I would love to hear Manatee folk say that 1 point W in the panhandle wasn't a big deal, you don't count.

Well here's a November game for you 

 

http://www.maxpreps.com/m/team/schedule.aspx?schoolid=db481745-3473-4327-a373-dbf128574298&ssid=d1db68fc-57d1-417d-af94-2a17b0dc8773

 

2006 Columbia traveled to Niceville and won in November before losing in opening round of playoffs to Eastside 

 

The year before Niceville won by 14 (same year they played Lakeland in the game mentioned above) 

 

That Columbia team was 5-5 and one of worst Columbia teams in past 25 years (one of only 3 times missing playoffs since 1993)

 

 

I would think a team like 1999 and 2001 Lincoln, 2005 Nease, 2012 and 2015 Columbia, 2015 Trinity Christian or 2012 Gainesville could have all been close to the quality of that Niceville team

 

Plus if i can use a team from about 14 months before i was born I'll throw in 1997 Columbia 

 

But let me guess, I know nothing because I am young?? 

 

Again I'm not saying that Lakeland played nothing but cupcakes prior to state but to say that Lakeland isn't going to have a tough road prior to state is crazy

 

You mentioned 2 teams

 

Mainland and Niceville 

 

 

Very good programs but at worst the 7a north is at least even with the number of threats now as it was then and when you throw in the south Florida threats (Venice, Plant City, Dwyer, St Thomas Aquinas) I think it is easy to argue that 7a as a whole is very healthy with some pretty dang good teams heading into the playoffs and i encourage anyone thinking otherwise to seriously look at some of these teams and realize there is some serious threats on both sides of the bracket 

[DisabledAccount]

I have nothing but respect for Lakeland and their program 

 

I just find it irresponsible when it seems people want to start booking St Thomas Aquinas vs Lakeland like it's already a lock

[gwdrum75]

33 minutes ago, ColumbiaHighFan2017class said:

I have nothing but respect for Lakeland and their program 

 

I just find it irresponsible when it seems people want to start booking St Thomas Aquinas vs Lakeland like it's already a lock

I don't think anyone has booked Lakeland to come out of the north. In the end, we all defend the team we support. Lakeland (City, school, alumni, fans) all have very high expectations for the team every year. Yes, there is legitimate criticism for Lakeland's schedule (see my previous post about scheduling hits & misses). But, we'll find out how good they really are starting next week. Then, one way or the other, the proof will be in the results.

As stated earlier......even in championship years, Lakeland never had the toughest schedule. So, we'll see over the next few weeks how that works out this season.

[Hwy17]

35 minutes ago, gwdrum75 said:

I don't think anyone has booked Lakeland to come out of the north. In the end, we all defend the team we support. Lakeland (City, school, alumni, fans) all have very high expectations for the team every year. Yes, there is legitimate criticism for Lakeland's schedule (see my previous post about scheduling hits & misses). But, we'll find out how good they really are starting next week. Then, one way or the other, the proof will be in the results.

As stated earlier......even in championship years, Lakeland never had the toughest schedule. So, we'll see over the next few weeks how that works out this season.

That was the whole point.  Some assume that because a team doesn't have as tough of a schedule as someone else, they won't win the championship, and that's just not the case.  

There is this "myth" that from 2004-2007 that Lakeland had no competition in the playoffs and an easy path to the finals.  From what I can remember and from what the record books say, that wasn't the case.  Niceville and Mainland were the first I recalled.  I had forgotten until I looked it up, 2004 Hillsborough was unbeaten when Lakeland played them in the playoffs.