Bad Press Is Good Press...Right?

[Ray Icaza]

3 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

What did he say specifically? That football players were being admitted via the scholarship feature that average joes can’t attain? The laws have changed and ANYONE in the state of Florida can apply to go to a private school. So maybe football players are given extra help with their application process. That wouldn’t mean other kids can’t apply. The scholarships are all done through the state. If the school wants to admit kids in a priority of how they can benefit the school I don’t see an issue with it. Private schools rely on money. Public schools just get millions of dollars thrown at it regardless of how incompetent or safe the school is. So I’m still not seeing the problem with kids wanting to get a better education coming from public schools that could be failing them. 

Flawed reasons you sight for leaving when you look at the two players we lost.  They both played at OHS their freshmen and sophomore seasons with significant varsity playing time as sophomores and were projected starters for next season.  Our school is not "FAILING THEM" academically, athletically or any other measure as we sent about a dozen seniors from the 2023 class to further their education thru football.  This list included 5 going to D1 schools like Florida, FSU, UCF, Oklahoma and Rutgers.  I ask you specifically like you ask others to tell me exactly why they left since I just debunked your stated reasons.   The answer is you have no idea but turning a blind eye to the "Possibility" of rule breaking is wrong.   By the way, losing those 2 will not ruin our upcoming season as we have others capable of stepping up in their place and so my concern isn't that. 

[Floridaatlantic1]

1 hour ago, Ray Icaza said:

Flawed reasons you sight for leaving when you look at the two players we lost.  They both played at OHS their freshmen and sophomore seasons with significant varsity playing time as sophomores and were projected starters for next season.  Our school is not "FAILING THEM" academically, athletically or any other measure as we sent about a dozen seniors from the 2023 class to further their education thru football.  This list included 5 going to D1 schools like Florida, FSU, UCF, Oklahoma and Rutgers.  I ask you specifically like you ask others to tell me exactly why they left since I just debunked your stated reasons.   The answer is you have no idea but turning a blind eye to the "Possibility" of rule breaking is wrong.   By the way, losing those 2 will not ruin our upcoming season as we have others capable of stepping up in their place and so my concern isn't that. 

Nole wants high schools to put together NIL packages and let the highest bidder win and the sad part is the FHSAA wont do anything even if they caught the team red handed recruiting with illegal benefits. Ridiculous

[nolebull813]

1 hour ago, Ray Icaza said:

Flawed reasons you sight for leaving when you look at the two players we lost.  They both played at OHS their freshmen and sophomore seasons with significant varsity playing time as sophomores and were projected starters for next season.  Our school is not "FAILING THEM" academically, athletically or any other measure as we sent about a dozen seniors from the 2023 class to further their education thru football.  This list included 5 going to D1 schools like Florida, FSU, UCF, Oklahoma and Rutgers.  I ask you specifically like you ask others to tell me exactly why they left since I just debunked your stated reasons.   The answer is you have no idea but turning a blind eye to the "Possibility" of rule breaking is wrong.   By the way, losing those 2 will not ruin our upcoming season as we have others capable of stepping up in their place and so my concern isn't that. 

You would have to ask those two kids specifically why they left. And sometimes it necessarily isn’t because things are wrong at their first school. It could be a parental choice where the kid doesn’t get a say. We have no idea unless you have specifically heard the kid and/or his parents say the exact reason why they transfered

[nolebull813]

13 minutes ago, Floridaatlantic1 said:

Nole wants high schools to put together NIL packages and let the highest bidder win and the sad part is the FHSAA wont do anything even if they caught the team red handed recruiting with illegal benefits. Ridiculous

I dont want any of that. I want the kids and their families to make the best decision for them both academically and athletically. Each case is completely different than the next. 

[Perspective]

1 hour ago, nolebull813 said:

I dont want any of that. I want the kids and their families to make the best decision for them both academically and athletically. Each case is completely different than the next. 

Nolebull, so here's the scenario:   A coach or a booster from a high school in Florida approaches a kid who plays football at a different school and offers that kid and/or that kid's parents a boatload of benefits (money, an apartment, or anything else that would, under existing rules, qualify as an "impermissible benefit").  Let's break this down:  it's OK for the kid and his family to accept the impermissible benefits as long as they believe that they're making the 'best decision' for their family.  And it's OK for the coach or booster to provide such impermissible benefits because that somehow improves the kid's chances of succeeding as an athlete and/or student.  Wait, it's not just "OK" for the coach or booster to do that, they should be encouraged to do that because that's the only way they'll be able to keep up with all the other coaches and boosters that are breaking the rules by providing impermissible benefits to other kids.  Have I got that right?  Do you want to do away with all the rules involving recruiting, benefits, transferring, etc. or just keep the rules in place, but not enforce them?  

#Lordoftheflies

[Ray Icaza]

2 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

You would have to ask those two kids specifically why they left. And sometimes it necessarily isn’t because things are wrong at their first school. It could be a parental choice where the kid doesn’t get a say. We have no idea unless you have specifically heard the kid and/or his parents say the exact reason why they transfered

Thanks for admitting that you do not know why they transferred or the several others that mysteriously transferred to that school (not a known powerhouse).  Thanks for also agreeing you specifically have to ask all the kids that left for seemingly inexplicable reasons why.  That happened as a matter of fact which raises suspicion thus the launch of an investigation by the FHSAA who hopefully will ask YOUR question as well as many more to get to the bottom of it.  Any fair-minded person should readily support this investigation.  If you don't support and admitted you don't know the facts, you are basically guilty of what some are accusing you of.  I would hope you would like to know the TRUTH as opposed to simply attacking the messengers.  

[nolebull813]

2 minutes ago, Ray Icaza said:

Thanks for admitting that you do not know why they transferred or the several others that mysteriously transferred to that school (not a known powerhouse).  Thanks for also agreeing you specifically have to ask all the kids that left for seemingly inexplicable reasons why.  That happened as a matter of fact which raises suspicion thus the launch of an investigation by the FHSAA who hopefully will ask YOUR question as well as many more to get to the bottom of it.  Any fair-minded person should readily support this investigation.  If you don't support and admitted you don't know the facts, you are basically guilty of what some are accusing you of.  I would hope you would like to know the TRUTH as opposed to simply attacking the messengers.  

I am a huge proponent of innocent until proven guilty, and due process with credible evidence. I support a credible investigation, and not some witch hunt by disgruntled folks both near and far from the program. Let’s hope they can get to the bottom of this quickly 

[nolebull813]

1 hour ago, Perspective said:

Nolebull, so here's the scenario:   A coach or a booster from a high school in Florida approaches a kid who plays football at a different school and offers that kid and/or that kid's parents a boatload of benefits (money, an apartment, or anything else that would, under existing rules, qualify as an "impermissible benefit").  Let's break this down:  it's OK for the kid and his family to accept the impermissible benefits as long as they believe that they're making the 'best decision' for their family.  And it's OK for the coach or booster to provide such impermissible benefits because that somehow improves the kid's chances of succeeding as an athlete and/or student.  Wait, it's not just "OK" for the coach or booster to do that, they should be encouraged to do that because that's the only way they'll be able to keep up with all the other coaches and boosters that are breaking the rules by providing impermissible benefits to other kids.  Have I got that right?  Do you want to do away with all the rules involving recruiting, benefits, transferring, etc. or just keep the rules in place, but not enforce them?  

#Lordoftheflies

To make it short and sweet. I am against breaking the rules. If there is a rule that seems outdated or unfair then it should be amended/changed/repealed with majority rule 

[nolebull813]

1 hour ago, Perspective said:

Nolebull, so here's the scenario:   A coach or a booster from a high school in Florida approaches a kid who plays football at a different school and offers that kid and/or that kid's parents a boatload of benefits (money, an apartment, or anything else that would, under existing rules, qualify as an "impermissible benefit").  Let's break this down:  it's OK for the kid and his family to accept the impermissible benefits as long as they believe that they're making the 'best decision' for their family.  And it's OK for the coach or booster to provide such impermissible benefits because that somehow improves the kid's chances of succeeding as an athlete and/or student.  Wait, it's not just "OK" for the coach or booster to do that, they should be encouraged to do that because that's the only way they'll be able to keep up with all the other coaches and boosters that are breaking the rules by providing impermissible benefits to other kids.  Have I got that right?  Do you want to do away with all the rules involving recruiting, benefits, transferring, etc. or just keep the rules in place, but not enforce them?  

#Lordoftheflies

Here’s a scenario that will cook your noodle. There’s an 11th grader at a D rated public school. Lives in a bad neighborhood with a single mom and a bunch of siblings. Dirt poor, and struggle just to eat and keep the lights on. He can’t get a part time job to help out because he has to watch his little siblings while his mom works. 
 

The school he plays for has poor attendance at the football games, and is always bad. He is a super star for them and tons of new bandwagon fans start to attend the games because they are good and he is the reason. School is making tons of new money. 
 

Season is over. Back to reality for him. School year is over. Summer hits. Some “runner” on behalf of the rich local private school “offers” his mom, him, and all his siblings a way out of poverty. New place to live, food on the table, and an opportunity to get a quality education and maximize exposure for all the top colleges to see. A once in a lifetime opportunity to get his family out of poverty.

What say you? Does he say no and continue to barely survive, or does he take the deal? 

[Longtime Observer]

11 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

What did he say specifically? That football players were being admitted via the scholarship feature that average joes can’t attain? The laws have changed and ANYONE in the state of Florida can apply to go to a private school. So maybe football players are given extra help with their application process. That wouldn’t mean other kids can’t apply. The scholarships are all done through the state. If the school wants to admit kids in a priority of how they can benefit the school I don’t see an issue with it. Private schools rely on money. Public schools just get millions of dollars thrown at it regardless of how incompetent or safe the school is. So I’m still not seeing the problem with kids wanting to get a better education coming from public schools that could be failing them. 

What this means is we will soon see one of two scenarios play out in the coming years:

1) A subset of students will eventually not be able to attend a "good" school because there is simply no space for them due to there being a scarcity of "good" schools

2) Assuming compulsory attendance remains a thing, we will see longtime elite private high schools nosedive in performance. The schools can not perform magic: unmotivated, unprepared often defiant students will NOT be good students no matter what the school does/doesn't do. And oftentimes these sorts of students do have parents who will do the absolute bare minimum needed to get the kid into a private school through the new rules.

Anyone who genuinely believes that the schools with higher test scores automatically do a better job of teaching the kids than schools with lower scores is an imbecile. 

[Floridaatlantic1]

18 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

I dont want any of that. I want the kids and their families to make the best decision for them both academically and athletically. Each case is completely different than the next. 

The issue is when the third issue become economic reasons as the new school provides benefits like free rent and other cash. Winter Park did this and stole like 15 players around the area in one year and got busted and NOTHING  happened to anyone. Kids missed a few meaningless regular season games and all played on playoffs. 

[Floridaatlantic1]

14 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

I am a huge proponent of innocent until proven guilty, and due process with credible evidence. I support a credible investigation, and not some witch hunt by disgruntled folks both near and far from the program. Let’s hope they can get to the bottom of this quickly 

The FHSAA has like staff to due investigations and even if its obvious, they slap them on wrist. 

[VeniceIndianFan]

Hey @Floridaatlantic1 . This idea has been floated a couple of times on here and I thought it was interesting. How about:

Instead of Metro/Suburban, public/private, transfer-based classes, or even promotion/demotion, the FHSAA broke the state into only 3 parts. North, Central, and South. Put all of the South Florida juggernauts into their own classification and let them play for 1 championship. Combine the North Florida rural schools and let them play for one championship while Central Florida combines to one class and plays for the final state championship. Playoff seeding will be determined by districts comprised of no fewer than 4 teams as well as SOS. At the end of the season, the winner of the "North" classification, would play the winner of the "Central" classification. Afterward, the winner of that game would play the winner of the "South" classification. And for once, we would have one "true" undisputed state champion. 

[Perspective]

On 4/17/2024 at 5:42 PM, nolebull813 said:

Here’s a scenario that will cook your noodle. There’s an 11th grader at a D rated public school. Lives in a bad neighborhood with a single mom and a bunch of siblings. Dirt poor, and struggle just to eat and keep the lights on. He can’t get a part time job to help out because he has to watch his little siblings while his mom works. 
 

The school he plays for has poor attendance at the football games, and is always bad. He is a super star for them and tons of new bandwagon fans start to attend the games because they are good and he is the reason. School is making tons of new money. 
 

Season is over. Back to reality for him. School year is over. Summer hits. Some “runner” on behalf of the rich local private school “offers” his mom, him, and all his siblings a way out of poverty. New place to live, food on the table, and an opportunity to get a quality education and maximize exposure for all the top colleges to see. A once in a lifetime opportunity to get his family out of poverty.

What say you? Does he say no and continue to barely survive, or does he take the deal? 

So, while it might be wrong, I would not blame the kid for taking the deal.   However, I would hold "the rich local private school" responsible for blatantly breaking the rules.  

[THAT S--T WAS FUNNY]

11 hours ago, Floridaatlantic1 said:

The issue is when the third issue become economic reasons as the new school provides benefits like free rent and other cash. Winter Park did this and stole like 15 players around the area in one year and got busted and NOTHING  happened to anyone. Kids missed a few meaningless regular season games and all played on playoffs. 

Guess who was an assistant coach on that staff at Winter Park. Heres a few hints...He runs the 7 on 7 team 24K. He left Winter Park last year and took the Head job at Leesburg. He then left Leesburg after 1 season and became the associate Head Coach at TFA. Im sure its just a coincidence though.

[DeCleater]

If kids are transferring to TFA because of getting a great education, what was the reasoning behind transferring to Leesburg last year?  Seems like a common denominator to me... 

[THAT S--T WAS FUNNY]

QB transferred from Wekiva to Leesburg to TFA in a span of three years. During that span he played for the 7 on 7 team 24K. Again, Im sure its just a coincidence.

[Floridaatlantic1]

On 4/18/2024 at 1:11 PM, VeniceIndianFan said:

Hey @Floridaatlantic1 . This idea has been floated a couple of times on here and I thought it was interesting. How about:

Instead of Metro/Suburban, public/private, transfer-based classes, or even promotion/demotion, the FHSAA broke the state into only 3 parts. North, Central, and South. Put all of the South Florida juggernauts into their own classification and let them play for 1 championship. Combine the North Florida rural schools and let them play for one championship while Central Florida combines to one class and plays for the final state championship. Playoff seeding will be determined by districts comprised of no fewer than 4 teams as well as SOS. At the end of the season, the winner of the "North" classification, would play the winner of the "Central" classification. Afterward, the winner of that game would play the winner of the "South" classification. And for once, we would have one "true" undisputed state champion. 

The plan would get crushed by smaller enrollments in central Florida and still does not address the recruiting issue. The reason a open division with like 16 teams or a promotion and demotion makes the most sense. 

[Floridaatlantic1]

On 4/18/2024 at 7:47 PM, THAT S--T WAS FUNNY said:

Guess who was an assistant coach on that staff at Winter Park. Heres a few hints...He runs the 7 on 7 team 24K. He left Winter Park last year and took the Head job at Leesburg. He then left Leesburg after 1 season and became the associate Head Coach at TFA. Im sure its just a coincidence though.

What a surprise a cheater from one of the worst examples of illegally recruiting scandal that resulted in Nothing happening ends up at another in house scandal. He better watch out, that wrist slap he got at Winter Park where nobody had any punishment whatsoever really stopped him huh. 

[Jullian]

I’m glad those recruiting rules don’t apply to Broward & Dade county…….

[Nulli Secundus]

On 4/17/2024 at 5:42 PM, nolebull813 said:

Here’s a scenario that will cook your noodle. There’s an 11th grader at a D rated public school. Lives in a bad neighborhood with a single mom and a bunch of siblings. Dirt poor, and struggle just to eat and keep the lights on. He can’t get a part time job to help out because he has to watch his little siblings while his mom works. 
 

The school he plays for has poor attendance at the football games, and is always bad. He is a super star for them and tons of new bandwagon fans start to attend the games because they are good and he is the reason. School is making tons of new money. 
 

Season is over. Back to reality for him. School year is over. Summer hits. Some “runner” on behalf of the rich local private school “offers” his mom, him, and all his siblings a way out of poverty. New place to live, food on the table, and an opportunity to get a quality education and maximize exposure for all the top colleges to see. A once in a lifetime opportunity to get his family out of poverty.

What say you? Does he say no and continue to barely survive, or does he take the deal? 

Are you talking about NIL or the school voucher program?