Playoffs

[Phfootball9]

The playoff brackets are posted on the fhsaa site this morning.

[Jesse]

1 hour ago, Phfootball9 said:

The playoff brackets are posted on the fhsaa site this morning.

Yeah,  Madison title on Dec 12 let's gooo.

[Perspective]

2 hours ago, Phfootball9 said:

The playoff brackets are posted on the fhsaa site this morning.

I just took a quick look at 7A.  In Region 1, Fleming Island (8) wouldn't face  Niceville (7)  until the Regional Finals.  In Region 2, Edgewater (2) wouldn't play Mitchell (9) until the Regional Finals.  In Region 3, Lakeland (3) would likely play the winner of the Bloomingdale (4) vs. Armwood (6) rematch in the Regional finals.  And in Region 4, University of STA (1) , with a first-round bye, would have to get passed Manatee (10) to face Venice (5) in the Regional finals. 

The numbers in parenthesis represents the teams current state ranking.   In all cases, the only time a ranked team would play another ranked team before the regional finals is if more than two ranked teams are in the same region (like Region 3). 

In short, and based solely on 7A, it looks a whole lot like the FHSAA went with a seeded tournament (based on records and rankings after 3 or 4 games) than the random, 'pick from a hat format' format that they said they were going to use.   Here I am . . . convince me otherwise.  

[Perspective]

8A looks about the same (again, numbers in parenthesis represent current state rankings by this site):

Region 1 - Lines up for a regional final between Bartram Trail (5) in the top half of the bracket and the winner of the showdown between Seminole (3) and Deland (9) in the bottom half of the bracket. 

Region 2 - Apopka (1)  starts with a bye, then gets the winner of Winter Park vs East Ridge, on their way to a regional finals game against a team not good enough to crack the top 15 at this point in the season. 

Region 3 - OK, we finally see something interesting in the top half of this bracket, although I'm not sure how random it is.   In the first round, Dr. Phillips (8) is scheduled to play Miami Palmetto (2).   This could be because Palmetto, while ranked 2nd, is currently win-less.  They're also currently loss-less.  They haven't played a game.  Their record is 0 - 0.   But they apparently opted in, so they're in the bracket.  Whoever wins that brutal first game will also have to get by Treasure Coast (6) to make it to the regional finals.  Waiting in the bottom half of the Region 3 bracket likely will be Vero (7), assuming they can pick up the two relatively easy wins to get them there -- but they are playoff games --  and not regular season games -- so who knows?   

Regions 4 - Teams that are ranked (or First Five out) all got byes (Steinbrenner, Newsome and Osceola), but once they all start playing, this one sets up for a Steinbrenner (10) vs. Osceola (4) regional finals game. 

 

Again, this one looks a whole lot like a seeded tournament, with top seeds getting byes and, with the one possible exception of Dr. Phillips vs. Miami Palmetto in the first round, top seeds getting the easier paths to the regional finals.   And other than the one aboration, I don't see any situations where the "two best teams in the region" play each other in an opening round game -- with or without a bye.   In short, it doesn't look very random to me.   Convince me I'm wrong. 

[Perspective]

And just to be clear, I have nothing against seeded brackets.  It's probably the fairest way to do it. 

But, it's not the way that the FHSAA said they were going to do it.  More importantly, if they changed their mind on how to set it up and chose to go with a seeded bracket instead of random, they should have waited until the end of the season (or at least the end of October) to do that -- especially this year.   A lot can change in 4 weeks.  

And don't even try to convince me I'm wrong about that! 

[Phfootball9]

Check out that travel for Gulf Breeze (6a, 2).  I don't think niceville is a getting to the regional final. There will have two teams that have been tough on them to get there. Navarre is pretty good this year. Crestview not so much but they are a cross town rival.

[DisabledAccount]

2 hours ago, Perspective said:

And just to be clear, I have nothing against seeded brackets.  It's probably the fairest way to do it. 

But, it's not the way that the FHSAA said they were going to do it.  More importantly, if they changed their mind on how to set it up and chose to go with a seeded bracket instead of random, they should have waited until the end of the season (or at least the end of October) to do that -- especially this year.   A lot can change in 4 weeks.  

And don't even try to convince me I'm wrong about that! 

Well they gonna feel like idiots then by postseason because there are a few teams with byes who will get exposed by teams within their region 

 

I would have preferred a NBA draft lottery type of thing after the October 30th games

[Joshua Wilson]

On 9/28/2020 at 5:45 PM, Perspective said:

So, did anyone else see the FHSAA announcement regarding the playoffs?   We already knew that any and all teams that 'stayed in' (i.e., did not opt out) would "make the playoffs" this season.  That's still the case.    The FHSAA previously announced that it might need to reclassify teams.  Apparently, they ended up keeping every team in the classification that they already were in, but adjusted some of the regions to better even out the number of teams in each of the four regions within each classification.  

Regional quarterfinals will start on Nov. 20th for the large-classification schools (5A-8A).  Typically, this would involve the top 8 teams in each of the four regions (in each classification) playing in a regional tournament to produce 4 regional champs.  Those 4 regional champions would then compete in the state semifinals and finals.   However, with the new system (that, in all likelihood, will only be used this year) in every case for these schools, there are more than 8 schools in each of the 4 regions.  So, on Nov. 13th, there will be a bunch of "play-in games" a la March Madness.     For example, in 8A Region 1, there are 11 teams.  Five of those teams essentially will get a bye, while the other six will play against each other to fill out the 8-team regional tournament bracket.   And, they reiterated today that seeding will be determined by blind draw (which could be done as early as next week). 

If I've done my math right, if a region has 16 teams, that means that all 16 teams will be playing a "play-in game" on Nov. 13th.   Might as well call it the first round of the playoffs.   Class 7A, Region 3 is an example of a region that has exactly 16 teams in it, including:  Armwood, Bloomingdale (who already has beaten Armwood and Tampa Bay Tech this season), Lakeland, Plant City and Tampa Bay Tech.  In theory, and if it truly is a blind draw, Armwood could be matched up against Lakeland in the opening round play-in game.   Wow.  That would be crazy. 

Now, here's where I get confused.   In Class 6A, each of the four regions has either 18 or 19 teams in it.   Assuming no Covid issues prevent any of the teams from playing, how do you fit 18 or 19 teams into a 16-team bracket?   What am I missing?    Josh, any thoughts? 

You have some teams were they are going to have to play two play in games. Pretty much what is going to happen to answer your question.

[Perspective]

1 hour ago, Joshua Wilson said:

You have some teams were they are going to have to play two play in games. Pretty much what is going to happen to answer your question.

Yeah,  I figured that part of it out.   ("Well, it looks like I already have an answer.   For those regions that have more than 16 teams in them, there will be another round of play-in games the week of Nov. 6th to determine the 16 teams that will play in the play-in games on Nov. 13th.")

What I haven't figured out is how the 'computer-generated blind draw' basically came out with the the same brackets (at least in 7A and 8A) as if the teams had been seeded (with one notable exception where Dr. Phillips have to travel to Miami to play Palmetto in the opening round).   I'm guessing records were somehow factored into the computer and Palmetto's 0 - 0 record caused this first round match-up to occur. 

[WhoopWhoop!!]

10 hours ago, Phfootball9 said:

Check out that travel for Gulf Breeze (6a, 2).  I don't think niceville is a getting to the regional final. There will have two teams that have been tough on them to get there. Navarre is pretty good this year. Crestview not so much but they are a cross town rival.

Yeah, that drive for Gulf Breeze is a haul to Daytona, and currently, Santa Rosa County has a policy of no overnight trips due to COVID. Curious if county allows them to leave on Thursday or have to drive that 7 plus hour trip on Friday. 
In recent years, I would agree on Navarre over Niceville, but this year I don’t think Navarre has the cats to stay with Niceville. I’ll go ahead and say Niceville wins that by 2 to 3 scores. 

[TRAJAN01]

How are the home teams going to be determined after the first round?  Is it going to be by coin flip for every round?  I noticed in the playoff brackets it denotes whether the home team is on the top line or the bottom line for each future game.....  @Joshua Wilson

[Perspective]

1 hour ago, TRAJAN01 said:

How are the home teams going to be determined after the first round?  Is it going to be by coin flip for every round?  I noticed in the playoff brackets it denotes whether the home team is on the top line or the bottom line for each future game.....  @Joshua Wilson

The brackets feed teams into either the top line or the bottom line.  At that point, it's predetermined who the home team is and who the visiting team is.   Similar to the way they used to do it.  Big difference is that there is no provision that prevents a team from hosting multiple home games or saves a team from having to play multiple away games.   I haven't looked at the brackets closely enough on the home team/visiting team issue, but I understand there is a possibility that a school could play as many as 4 home games in a row or 4 away games in a row.   In any event, I think it's pretty easy to pull up the brackets and determine where your school would play a certain game if it were to advance. 

[TRAJAN01]

Thanks @Perspective I was wondering about that because I see where we(Wakulla) travel to Pensacola Pine Forest in the first round...but if we win we would host every game after that....based on the predetermined home teams.  For some reason I thought they were going to determine home teams by a coin flip.

[Perspective]

27 minutes ago, TRAJAN01 said:

Thanks @Perspective I was wondering about that because I see where we(Wakulla) travel to Pensacola Pine Forest in the first round...but if we win we would host every game after that....based on the predetermined home teams.  For some reason I thought they were going to determine home teams by a coin flip.

Initially, I believe FHSAA did state that the home team for each round would be determined by coin flip.   However, perhaps in response to the national coin shortage, they decided that the 'random blind-draw' process was just as random as a coin flip.   And, yes, it appears that Wakulla gets to stay at home all the way to the State Finals if they can beat Pensacola Pine Forest.  Good luck!

[TRAJAN01]

15 minutes ago, Perspective said:

Initially, I believe FHSAA did state that the home team for each round would be determined by coin flip.   However, perhaps in response to the national coin shortage, they decided that the 'random blind-draw' process was just as random as a coin flip.   And, yes, it appears that Wakulla gets to stay at home all the way to the State Finals if they can beat Pensacola Pine Forest.  Good luck!

Thanks @Perspective I don't know how good Pine Forest is this year...but we're looking pretty good again.  We were thinking we would see them in the regional finals last year and they got upset by Godby in the regional semifinals.  We were 13-0 going into the state semifinals last year against Orlando Jones.  We lost 21-20 on a missed extra point in the 4th quarter....gut punch. lol

[Jesse]

4 hours ago, TRAJAN01 said:

Thanks @Perspective I don't know how good Pine Forest is this year...but we're looking pretty good again.  We were thinking we would see them in the regional finals last year and they got upset by Godby in the regional semifinals.  We were 13-0 going into the state semifinals last year against Orlando Jones.  We lost 21-20 on a missed extra point in the 4th quarter....gut punch. lol

Wakulla???. Did madison say no to playing yall???

[TRAJAN01]

8 minutes ago, Jesse said:

Wakulla???. Did madison say no to playing yall???

They tried to get a game worked out this year but i don't think they had the same open dates available.

[Jesse]

2 hours ago, TRAJAN01 said:

They tried to get a game worked out this year but i don't think they had the same open dates available.

Dang i guess madison wanted a real challenge.   

[OldSchoolLion]

9 hours ago, Perspective said:

Initially, I believe FHSAA did state that the home team for each round would be determined by coin flip.   However, perhaps in response to the national coin shortage, they decided that the 'random blind-draw' process was just as random as a coin flip.   And, yes, it appears that Wakulla gets to stay at home all the way to the State Finals if they can beat Pensacola Pine Forest.  Good luck!

I still have yet to recover from the great Gadsden coin flip debacle

[Phfootball9]

On 10/7/2020 at 8:52 PM, WhoopWhoop!! said:

Yeah, that drive for Gulf Breeze is a haul to Daytona, and currently, Santa Rosa County has a policy of no overnight trips due to COVID. Curious if county allows them to leave on Thursday or have to drive that 7 plus hour trip on Friday. 
In recent years, I would agree on Navarre over Niceville, but this year I don’t think Navarre has the cats to stay with Niceville. I’ll go ahead and say Niceville wins that by 2 to 3 scores. 

Well we get to see about the Niceville v. Navarre question this Friday. Wish I could be there should be a good one.

[blackmagic]

On 10/8/2020 at 9:42 AM, Perspective said:

The brackets feed teams into either the top line or the bottom line.  At that point, it's predetermined who the home team is and who the visiting team is.   Similar to the way they used to do it.  Big difference is that there is no provision that prevents a team from hosting multiple home games or saves a team from having to play multiple away games.   I haven't looked at the brackets closely enough on the home team/visiting team issue, but I understand there is a possibility that a school could play as many as 4 home games in a row or 4 away games in a row.   In any event, I think it's pretty easy to pull up the brackets and determine where your school would play a certain game if it were to advance. 

The should have a coin flip for state semifinals.  Huge advantage to the team that host. Don't give team home game just cause they are in region 1 and region 3.

[Perspective]

12 hours ago, blackmagic said:

The should have a coin flip for state semifinals.  Huge advantage to the team that host. Don't give team home game just cause they are in region 1 and region 3.

I think if you were to pose this question to the FHSAA, they would say that this is exactly what they already have done. 

I wasn't there, so I don't know if it actually happened this way, but I think that's what they would say. 

[blackmagic]

13 hours ago, Perspective said:

I think if you were to pose this question to the FHSAA, they would say that this is exactly what they already have done. 

I wasn't there, so I don't know if it actually happened this way, but I think that's what they would say. 

Every bracket has region 1 and 3 as home team. No way you get 100% home for these teams on a blind draw. 

 

If I'm wrong someone correct me please. 

[Perspective]

9 hours ago, blackmagic said:

Every bracket has region 1 and 3 as home team. No way you get 100% home for these teams on a blind draw. 

 

If I'm wrong someone correct me please. 

BlackMagic, I could be wrong, but here's the way I'm reading the FHSAA brackets (in all cases, the winner of Region 1 plays the winner of Region 2 and the winner of Region 3 plays the winner of Region 4):

In 8A, the winners of Regions 2 and 3 will host the state semifinal games.

In 7A, the winners of Regions 1 and 3 will host the state semifinal games.

In 6A, the winners of Regions 2 and 4 will host the state semifinal games.

In 5A, the winners of Regions 1 and 4 will host the state semifinal games.

In 4A, the winners of Regions 2 and 3 will host the state semifinal games.

In 3A, the winners of Regions 2 and 3 will host the state semifinal games.

In 2A, the winners of Regions 1 and 3 will host the state semifinal games.

In 1A, the winners of Regions 1 and 4 will host the state semifinal games.

 

 

[uncleluke23]

On 10/11/2020 at 8:23 AM, Phfootball9 said:

Well we get to see about the Niceville v. Navarre question this Friday. Wish I could be there should be a good one.

I haven't seen neither team play this year but just looking at their schedules, I expect Niceville to beat Navarre by 2 or 3 scores as well. Niceville and Milton look the best so far in the Panhandle, which doesn't mean much compared to rest of state.