Snap shot of Dade & Broward recruiting…..strike that, “Transfers”

[Jullian]

Here are the schools with the most “transfers” via Blustein as of 8/17. 
Central leads the way with 6 out of state transfers(AlabamaX2, Arkansas, Rhode IslandX2, & Colorado). Unparalleled by any school IN the state outside of IMG. 

Dade: 

NW 18. Central 15. Norland 14. Homestead 10. Carol city & Columbus active also. 
 

Broward:

Monarch 17. Chaminade 14. Western 14. Coconut Creek 13. STA 12. Gibbons & Stranahan active also. 

SO U EXCITED ABOUT THE SEASON????

imagine the coach from improving Sarasota Booker gets “arrested” by the FHSAA for attempting to recruit ONE player. 

 

[ExplorerHomer2]

17 hours ago, Jullian said:

Here are the schools with the most “transfers” via Blustein as of 8/17. 
Central leads the way with 6 out of state transfers(AlabamaX2, Arkansas, Rhode IslandX2, & Colorado). Unparalleled by any school IN the state outside of IMG. 

Dade: 

NW 18. Central 15. Norland 14. Homestead 10. Carol city & Columbus active also. 
 

Broward:

Monarch 17. Chaminade 14. Western 14. Coconut Creek 13. STA 12. Gibbons & Stranahan active also. 

SO U EXCITED ABOUT THE SEASON????

imagine the coach from improving Sarasota Booker gets “arrested” by the FHSAA for attempting to recruit ONE player. 

 

 

17 hours ago, Jullian said:

Here are the schools with the most “transfers” via Blustein as of 8/17. 
Central leads the way with 6 out of state transfers(AlabamaX2, Arkansas, Rhode IslandX2, & Colorado). Unparalleled by any school IN the state outside of IMG. 

Dade: 

NW 18. Central 15. Norland 14. Homestead 10. Carol city & Columbus active also. 
 

Broward:

Monarch 17. Chaminade 14. Western 14. Coconut Creek 13. STA 12. Gibbons & Stranahan active also. 

SO U EXCITED ABOUT THE SEASON????

imagine the coach from improving Sarasota Booker gets “arrested” by the FHSAA for attempting to recruit ONE player. 

 

Crazy. But to be fair, Columbus really isn't "active" with transfers this year like CC (I wish we were). On that list we had a grand total of 3 transfer in and 1 transferred out - none of them starred players.  By comparison Carol City had 13 transfer in. We really could use a few transfers this season! LOL!

Just want to put that out there, because I know some folks on this site, particularly those upstate, who love to complain about how the privates  (at least in BROWARD) have this perceived unfair advantage when it comes to transfers, in DADE it is the super publics who dominate at this game. Not taking away anything from the fact that the privates are usually better funded with better facilities, but Columbus has NEVER had more than maybe 7-8 transfers in a single season ever and usually its 3-5 max.

MC and MNW  are on another level altogether.

But to your point, what the hell is going on in Sarasota? Sounds like there is more to that story? Sleepy town politics? That's so messed up.

[nolebull813]

I would be curious to see this in the context of who transferred out of these places as well. Maybe a “Net” number of transfers so to speak 

[Longtime Observer]

19 hours ago, Jullian said:

Here are the schools with the most “transfers” via Blustein as of 8/17. 
Central leads the way with 6 out of state transfers(AlabamaX2, Arkansas, Rhode IslandX2, & Colorado). Unparalleled by any school IN the state outside of IMG. 

Dade: 

NW 18. Central 15. Norland 14. Homestead 10. Carol city & Columbus active also. 
 

Broward:

Monarch 17. Chaminade 14. Western 14. Coconut Creek 13. STA 12. Gibbons & Stranahan active also. 

SO U EXCITED ABOUT THE SEASON????

imagine the coach from improving Sarasota Booker gets “arrested” by the FHSAA for attempting to recruit ONE player. 

 

As you probably know, the rest of the state views Dade/Broward as a scary sort of foreign land (and those in Dade/Broward view the rest of the state as a scary sort of country bumpkin place). Most in Gainesville threw up their hands and quit bothering to get involved in Dade/Broward years ago. Public schools in the rest of the state are held to a different standard by many. Though there's no way to be sure how many transfers schools end up with until the school year literally starts.

 

 

[Perspective]

1 hour ago, ExplorerHomer2 said:

But to your point, what the hell is going on in Sarasota? Sounds like there is more to that story? Sleepy town politics? That's so messed up.

This might help:

https://www.heraldtribune.com/story/sports/high-school/football/2024/07/10/booker-football-coach-scottie-littles-suspended-6-games-fined-for-recruiting-violation/73265547007/

Having read the article, I understand the improper contact charge, but I didn't see anything in there that smacks of impermissible benefits.   

That said, this is yet another example of how the FHSAA system works against the honest schools and coaches.  Someone, anyone, sends something in to the FHSAA.  Instead of investigating, they simply send it out to the school and say, "hey, do you know anything about this?"   The school then reviews it internally (and perhaps only by school/athletic administration folks, such that the coach isn't even involved).  If the school determines that there is a fire behind the smoke, it can then "self-report" the violation.  Once the violation has been self-reported (which was the case in this matter, according to the article), the FHSAA hands down its sanction and because the self-report essentially acts as an admission of guilt, the FHSAA feels justified in throwing the book at the accused coach.  In so doing, the FHSAA picks up an easy win and word spreads of the punishment, which then, presumably, has a chilling affect on other coaches across the state.  

This story has been told before. 

[Longtime Observer]

1 hour ago, ExplorerHomer2 said:

 

Crazy. But to be fair, Columbus really isn't "active" with transfers this year like CC (I wish we were). On that list we had a grand total of 3 transfer in and 1 transferred out - none of them starred players.  By comparison Carol City had 13 transfer in. We really could use a few transfers this season! LOL!

Just want to put that out there, because I know some folks on this site, particularly those upstate, who love to complain about how the privates  (at least in BROWARD) have this perceived unfair advantage when it comes to transfers, in DADE it is the super publics who dominate at this game. Not taking away anything from the fact that the privates are usually better funded with better facilities, but Columbus has NEVER had more than maybe 7-8 transfers in a single season ever and usually its 3-5 max.

MC and MNW  are on another level altogether.

But to your point, what the hell is going on in Sarasota? Sounds like there is more to that story? Sleepy town politics? That's so messed up.

As far as the rules and culture go, public schools now have an advantage over private schools in attracting players. Of course, the biggest, best private schools still have an overall advantage when you factor in the wealth of the student body/alumni. And those located right in the middle of dense urban areas have many more players to pick from within a reasonable driving distance.

It looks like Venice was pissed to lose their starting RB. So, they turned in Booker. The player in question appeared headed to Lakeland for a time after leaving Booker. But, perhaps had a change of heart and felt the hassle wasn't worth it. 

[Jullian]

2 hours ago, ExplorerHomer2 said:

 

Crazy. But to be fair, Columbus really isn't "active" with transfers this year like CC (I wish we were). On that list we had a grand total of 3 transfer in and 1 transferred out - none of them starred players.  By comparison Carol City had 13 transfer in. We really could use a few transfers this season! LOL!

Just want to put that out there, because I know some folks on this site, particularly those upstate, who love to complain about how the privates  (at least in BROWARD) have this perceived unfair advantage when it comes to transfers, in DADE it is the super publics who dominate at this game. Not taking away anything from the fact that the privates are usually better funded with better facilities, but Columbus has NEVER had more than maybe 7-8 transfers in a single season ever and usually its 3-5 max.

MC and MNW  are on another level altogether.

But to your point, what the hell is going on in Sarasota? Sounds like there is more to that story? Sleepy town politics? That's so messed up.

Agree. They were on Blu’s list once or twice. 

[Perspective]

3 hours ago, Longtime Observer said:

It looks like Venice was pissed to lose their starting RB. So, they turned in Booker. The player in question appeared headed to Lakeland for a time after leaving Booker. But, perhaps had a change of heart and felt the hassle wasn't worth it. 

If this doesn't define the word "irony," I don't know what does. 

[PinellasFB]

I know this thread is about Dade and Broward but there is a team in Pinellas County that is getting transfer after transfer in and that is Tarpon Springs.  Something fishy going on over in Tarpon.  This team was 1-9 and nearly didn't have enough players to field a team just three years ago but now they are successfully going after everyone's players.  Makes you wonder if there is a big money donor behind all of this?  The only local teams usually this active in the transfer scene are CCC and Lakewood.  Everyone else is just a plucked player here and there but not a full new team.

On this subject, those Dade and Broward teams with 10+ transfers... WTF that is recruiting a new team every year and just not in the spirit of HS sports.  Maybe they should add a rule that any team with 7+ (or something like that) transfers in gets thrown into the open division automatically?  I'd be okay with that.

[PinellasFB]

On 7/22/2024 at 12:36 PM, Perspective said:

This might help:

https://www.heraldtribune.com/story/sports/high-school/football/2024/07/10/booker-football-coach-scottie-littles-suspended-6-games-fined-for-recruiting-violation/73265547007/

"No school employee, athletic department staff member, representative of the school’s athletic interests or third parties, such as an independent person, business or organization, may make contact, either in person or through any form of written or electronic communication or through any third party, with a student, or any member of the student’s family, in an effort to pressure, urge or entice the student to attend a different school for the purpose of participating in interscholastic athletics."

This rule is such bullshit.  Clearly this is going on, especially through third parties like the players themselves.  I've seen plenty of recruiting texts to our players from players of another team.

[Jullian]

58 minutes ago, PinellasFB said:

This rule is such bullshit.  Clearly this is going on, especially through third parties like the players themselves.  I've seen plenty of recruiting texts to our players from players of another team.

Correct. Player to player but also “coach to neighborhood to player” a lot of ways to INITIATE transfers. There’s some on here that love these super teams. I think it’s ruined HSFB. 80% (if not higher) of teams in the state will have no chance of winning a state championship. 

[Dr. D]

Definitely higher.  95% of teams have zero chance to win a state championship. 

[Perspective]

3 hours ago, PinellasFB said:

This rule is such bullshit.  Clearly this is going on, especially through third parties like the players themselves.  I've seen plenty of recruiting texts to our players from players of another team.

So take a screen shot of the text message and send it to the FHSAA.   That's the only way you're going to put a stop to it. Yeah, you may burn a few bridges, but you may also put a stop to it. 

[THAT S--T WAS FUNNY]

3 hours ago, PinellasFB said:

 Something fishy going on over in Tarpon.  

I see what you did there...LOL

[Perspective]

4 minutes ago, Perspective said:

So take a screen shot of the text message and send it to the FHSAA.   That's the only way you're going to put a stop to it. Yeah, you may burn a few bridges, but you may also put a stop to it. 

And I'll make this comment as general as possible so that it's not directed to or at any person:   if you're not willing to say something (i.e., turn in those that are clearly breaking the rules), then you really shouldn't bitch about it.  If you think what's happening is wrong and you have the receipts to prove it (and you don't live in a glass house), speak out. 

[PinellasFB]

19 minutes ago, Perspective said:

And I'll make this comment as general as possible so that it's not directed to or at any person:   if you're not willing to say something (i.e., turn in those that are clearly breaking the rules), then you really shouldn't bitch about it.  If you think what's happening is wrong and you have the receipts to prove it (and you don't live in a glass house), speak out. 

I agree with you in principal but like anything, there's more to it than that.  I was shown messages in confidence.  To take action would violate this confidence.  There's also my place, which it is not my place to take this action as there is a good relationship between our coaching staff and the staff of this other team.  Finally, I do believe these players acted on their own in this case and not based upon direction from their coaches.  This is only a gut feeling so I could be wrong.  Anyway, the right people know about this and I leave it up to them.  I am also proud that our coaches don't recruit, don't believe it is in the spirit of HS sports, and would rather go with the players that want to be there.  We will never win a title this way but it makes what we do win that much sweeter.  I don't really know how anyone can feel proud of a bunch of rent-a-players winning games for them.

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

13 hours ago, PinellasFB said:

I agree with you in principal but like anything, there's more to it than that.  I was shown messages in confidence.  To take action would violate this confidence.  There's also my place, which it is not my place to take this action as there is a good relationship between our coaching staff and the staff of this other team.  Finally, I do believe these players acted on their own in this case and not based upon direction from their coaches.  This is only a gut feeling so I could be wrong.  Anyway, the right people know about this and I leave it up to them.  I am also proud that our coaches don't recruit, don't believe it is in the spirit of HS sports, and would rather go with the players that want to be there.  We will never win a title this way but it makes what we do win that much sweeter.  I don't really know how anyone can feel proud of a bunch of rent-a-players winning games for them.

Tbh I’m with you. As an avid Dillard high alum, former player & fan. So many years I wished that we had the transfer portal & the championships that came with it of a Miami central , Miami northwestern , Sta. To see Dillard high when a state title in football in my lifetime would be one of the proudest moments in my life. 
 

but at the same time I’m also old school where if you wanted to be the BEST you beat the best. I come from an era “90’s” where there were no super teams (To my Knowledge). There was pride and tradition to play for your HOME school & bring success to said school.

now everyone wants microwave success aka super teams. No loyalty to the school what so ever everyone just load up at 1 school and make winning the championship as easy as possible. 

[Longtime Observer]

20 hours ago, PinellasFB said:

I know this thread is about Dade and Broward but there is a team in Pinellas County that is getting transfer after transfer in and that is Tarpon Springs.  Something fishy going on over in Tarpon.  This team was 1-9 and nearly didn't have enough players to field a team just three years ago but now they are successfully going after everyone's players.  Makes you wonder if there is a big money donor behind all of this?  The only local teams usually this active in the transfer scene are CCC and Lakewood.  Everyone else is just a plucked player here and there but not a full new team.

On this subject, those Dade and Broward teams with 10+ transfers... WTF that is recruiting a new team every year and just not in the spirit of HS sports.  Maybe they should add a rule that any team with 7+ (or something like that) transfers in gets thrown into the open division automatically?  I'd be okay with that.

The biggest factor for Tarpon Springs was the folding of the Clearwater Academy football program. The head coach for CAI was picked up as OC at TS. His QB, who started at TS, followed him back there as did some other good players. This influx made the program much more attractive. And, there really aren't a lot of great alternatives in the immediate area for football. There's no program with such a great resume and such great resources that they can win recruiting battles for players. 

Many of the CAI players shopped around at a wider range of programs. But, most of the CAI kids needed housing and/or a program near CAI. I believe it's possible some/all of the CAI transfers may still attend and receive housing at CAI. They'd be allowed to play at TS even while not attending the school since CAI doesn't offer football anymore.

[Longtime Observer]

17 hours ago, Perspective said:

So take a screen shot of the text message and send it to the FHSAA.   That's the only way you're going to put a stop to it. Yeah, you may burn a few bridges, but you may also put a stop to it. 

Most of what would be sent is nearly impossible to prosecute. I mean, if a fan direct messages a kid and says "hey, you should come play for Venice. We really need you!", who/what do you expect to be done? It's a fan sending a simple message. Same thing if it's a 16 year-old boy who plays on the team sending the message. Those kinds of messages may or may not be persuasive. But, I don't see how you could justify some sort of penalty. Especially given the fact that some rival schools may use a little photoshop and make up images of such messages.

Ultimately, I think it is highly debatable as to whether the above is even wrong morally.

As I've said, the picture many have in their minds of "recruiting" often doesn't match reality. Fans may picture a creepy old man hiding in some bushes who pops out and offers a kid a stack of cash if he transfers. That's not reality, at least not in the 2020s.

[FBGUY1989]

11 hours ago, THIS_IS_DILLARD said:

Tbh I’m with you. As an avid Dillard high alum, former player & fan. So many years I wished that we had the transfer portal & the championships that came with it of a Miami central , Miami northwestern , Sta. To see Dillard high when a state title in football in my lifetime would be one of the proudest moments in my life. 
 

but at the same time I’m also old school where if you wanted to be the BEST you beat the best. I come from an era “90’s” where there were no super teams (To my Knowledge). There was pride and tradition to play for your HOME school & bring success to said school.

now everyone wants microwave success aka super teams. No loyalty to the school what so ever everyone just load up at 1 school and make winning the championship as easy as possible. 

A lot of it has to do with how well your school is doing and not just with football. I'm sure if you have a son you'd want him to play for Dillard. Now if St. Thomas, American Heritage or Chammiade came running along you wouldn't think twice putting your son at one of them

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

2 hours ago, FBGUY1989 said:

A lot of it has to do with how well your school is doing and not just with football. I'm sure if you have a son you'd want him to play for Dillard. Now if St. Thomas, American Heritage or Chammiade came running along you wouldn't think twice putting your son at one of them

Actually I would because the grass isn’t always greener on the other side. My son turns 21 in sept & never did I think about having him at one of those private schools. 
 

sure they have the boosters & college connects. But I’m a firm believer as to what’s for you will be for you. & hard work pays off. 
 

you can step foot on dillard campus and be the best thing that came through there since Issac Bruce & the offers will be there. 
 

in todays society these kids don’t want to work for anything. It’s monkey see monkey do if a bunch of kids aka their friends are all teaming up to play for whatever the “IT” school is that year that’s where they go. 
 

where’s the loyalty ? Where’s the pride ? If you ask me getting a ring as a super team , means nothing compared to a team that got it from the mud & actually earned it from hard work. Even if it took a down freshmen & sophomore year to get better & achieve said goal. 

[Perspective]

23 hours ago, Longtime Observer said:

Most of what would be sent is nearly impossible to prosecute. I mean, if a fan direct messages a kid and says "hey, you should come play for Venice. We really need you!", who/what do you expect to be done? It's a fan sending a simple message. Same thing if it's a 16 year-old boy who plays on the team sending the message. Those kinds of messages may or may not be persuasive. But, I don't see how you could justify some sort of penalty. Especially given the fact that some rival schools may use a little photoshop and make up images of such messages.

Ultimately, I think it is highly debatable as to whether the above is even wrong morally.

As I've said, the picture many have in their minds of "recruiting" often doesn't match reality. Fans may picture a creepy old man hiding in some bushes who pops out and offers a kid a stack of cash if he transfers. That's not reality, at least not in the 2020s.

I'm confused.  Are we talking about the way it is or the way it should be?

Here's what Policy 37.1.1 of the FHSAA Handbook says:

"No school employee, athletic department staff member, representative of the school’s athletic interests or third parties, such as an independent person, business or organization, may make contact, either in person or through any form of written or electronic communication or through any third party, with a student, or any member of the student’s family, in an effort to pressure, urge or entice the student to attend a different school for the purpose of participating in interscholastic athletics."

So, does this apply to a fan or a existing player player on team?  Good question.  Clearly the rule applies to an existing player on a team (see below) and it may apply to a fan if that fan falls within the definition of a "representative of a school's athletic interests."  Here is how the FHSAA defines that term:

 

36.2.1.1 Representative of a School’s Athletic Interests. “Representative of a school’s athletic interests”
refers to any independent person, business or organization that participates in, assists with and/or promotes that school’s interscholastic athletic program. This includes:
(a) A student-athlete or other student participant in the athletic program at that school;
(b) The parents, guardians or other family members of a student-athlete or other student participant in the athletic program at that school;
(c) Immediate relatives of a coach or other member of the athletic department staff at that school;
(d) A volunteer with that school’s athletic program;
(e) A member of an athletic booster organization of that school;
(f) A person, business or organization that makes financial or in-kind contributions to the athletic department or that is
otherwise involved in promoting the school’s interscholastic athletic program.

Whether it should be the rule is subject to debate, but as it stands now, if a kid from one team sends out a text, a DM, an email, a telegraph or a smoke signal to a kid at another school trying to persuade that kid to transfer, that's recruiting and that's illegal.  Same thing if a coach does it.  Same thing if a parent of a kid on the team does.  Same thing if a dude who is a member of the booster club does it. 

Would it apply to a "fan?"  I don't know; let's use someone like This_is_Dillard as an example?  Clearly, he's an alum, but he doesn't have a kid at Dillard anymore (if my recollection is correct).  If he's not a booster, not a volunteer and makes no financial or in-kind contributions to the team and is not involved in promoting the program, he may not qualify.  Interesting question arises as to whether someone who comes on a message board and repeatedly posts positive things about his former school would qualify as a "promoter," thus making him a representative of the school's athletic interests.   That's a grey area for me. 

As for the "photoshop" argument, that's what lawyers would call "an evidentiary issue."  The entity investigating (i.e., the FHSAA) likely would have to subpoena phone records to find out what text messages were sent from what devices and who owned those devices.  Photoshopped messages might be enough to start an investigation, but it likely would not stand up to evidentiary scrutiny if the issue gets raised.   The tough issue would be if a text got sent and the person who allegedly sent it claims they were hacked or their phone was temporarily removed from their possession by some rogue texter trying to get a particular school in trouble. 

Again, we can debate all day long what the rules should be, and we can debate all day if the FHSAA does anything about the information once received, but like it or not, what the rules are is pretty clear. 

[Longtime Observer]

18 minutes ago, Perspective said:

I'm confused.  Are we talking about the way it is or the way it should be?

Here's what Policy 37.1.1 of the FHSAA Handbook says:

"No school employee, athletic department staff member, representative of the school’s athletic interests or third parties, such as an independent person, business or organization, may make contact, either in person or through any form of written or electronic communication or through any third party, with a student, or any member of the student’s family, in an effort to pressure, urge or entice the student to attend a different school for the purpose of participating in interscholastic athletics."

So, does this apply to a fan or a existing player player on team?  Good question.  Clearly the rule applies to an existing player on a team (see below) and it may apply to a fan if that fan falls within the definition of a "representative of a school's athletic interests."  Here is how the FHSAA defines that term:

 

36.2.1.1 Representative of a School’s Athletic Interests. “Representative of a school’s athletic interests”
refers to any independent person, business or organization that participates in, assists with and/or promotes that school’s interscholastic athletic program. This includes:
(a) A student-athlete or other student participant in the athletic program at that school;
(b) The parents, guardians or other family members of a student-athlete or other student participant in the athletic program at that school;
(c) Immediate relatives of a coach or other member of the athletic department staff at that school;
(d) A volunteer with that school’s athletic program;
(e) A member of an athletic booster organization of that school;
(f) A person, business or organization that makes financial or in-kind contributions to the athletic department or that is
otherwise involved in promoting the school’s interscholastic athletic program.

Whether it should be the rule is subject to debate, but as it stands now, if a kid from one team sends out a text, a DM, an email, a telegraph or a smoke signal to a kid at another school trying to persuade that kid to transfer, that's recruiting and that's illegal.  Same thing if a coach does it.  Same thing if a parent of a kid on the team does.  Same thing if a dude who is a member of the booster club does it. 

Would it apply to a "fan?"  I don't know; let's use someone like This_is_Dillard as an example?  Clearly, he's an alum, but he doesn't have a kid at Dillard anymore (if my recollection is correct).  If he's not a booster, not a volunteer and makes no financial or in-kind contributions to the team and is not involved in promoting the program, he may not qualify.  Interesting question arises as to whether someone who comes on a message board and repeatedly posts positive things about his former school would qualify as a "promoter," thus making him a representative of the school's athletic interests.   That's a grey area for me. 

As for the "photoshop" argument, that's what lawyers would call "an evidentiary issue."  The entity investigating (i.e., the FHSAA) likely would have to subpoena phone records to find out what text messages were sent from what devices and who owned those devices.  Photoshopped messages might be enough to start an investigation, but it likely would not stand up to evidentiary scrutiny if the issue gets raised.   The tough issue would be if a text got sent and the person who allegedly sent it claims they were hacked or their phone was temporarily removed from their possession by some rogue texter trying to get a particular school in trouble. 

Again, we can debate all day long what the rules should be, and we can debate all day if the FHSAA does anything about the information once received, but like it or not, what the rules are is pretty clear. 

The rules can be clear, but the individual situations not as clear. "Plausible deniability" is a beast. How can a school or coach possibly police the private messaging of one of their fans? It's not possible for John Peacock to peer into the private inboxes of every single person on the planet who may cheer for Venice and may want to send a hotshot recruit a message saying "come play for Venice!". Not to mention rogue actors. I've rooted against Venice in the state title game the last couple of years. What's to stop me from messaging a top recruit and saying "You should play for Venice" in hopes of getting the message reported and Venice in trouble? (I don't message kids or their parents as I personally find it creepy). There are just myriad scenarios where any reasonable person can tell what's going on without having much confidence it can hold up under investigation, in court etc.

The other aspect is kids/parents who may receive such messages from a dozen other schools. Do they get to be selective and turn one or two in and ignore the rest? If a Lakeland fan contacts a kid from, say, Bloomingdale and encourages them to play for Lakeland, but the kid goes and plays for Armwood instead (and someone from Armwood had reached out in much the same way as the Lakeland fan), who's guilty? What if the same kid also heard from Sumner and Tampa Bay Tech and ten other schools?

It's all a mess. *Every* school is trying to attract as many good players- be it incoming 9th graders or transfers- as possible. Oftentimes, style of play and depth chart are significant factors, and those require conversations of some sort to clarify. 

[Perspective]

2 hours ago, Longtime Observer said:

The rules can be clear, but the individual situations not as clear. "Plausible deniability" is a beast. How can a school or coach possibly police the private messaging of one of their fans? It's not possible for John Peacock to peer into the private inboxes of every single person on the planet who may cheer for Venice and may want to send a hotshot recruit a message saying "come play for Venice!". Not to mention rogue actors. I've rooted against Venice in the state title game the last couple of years. What's to stop me from messaging a top recruit and saying "You should play for Venice" in hopes of getting the message reported and Venice in trouble? (I don't message kids or their parents as I personally find it creepy). There are just myriad scenarios where any reasonable person can tell what's going on without having much confidence it can hold up under investigation, in court etc.

The other aspect is kids/parents who may receive such messages from a dozen other schools. Do they get to be selective and turn one or two in and ignore the rest? If a Lakeland fan contacts a kid from, say, Bloomingdale and encourages them to play for Lakeland, but the kid goes and plays for Armwood instead (and someone from Armwood had reached out in much the same way as the Lakeland fan), who's guilty? What if the same kid also heard from Sumner and Tampa Bay Tech and ten other schools?

It's all a mess. *Every* school is trying to attract as many good players- be it incoming 9th graders or transfers- as possible. Oftentimes, style of play and depth chart are significant factors, and those require conversations of some sort to clarify. 

So, let's break this down. 

Schools cannot control what their fans do, but schools can be punished if certain of their fans break the rules.  Is this fair?  I don't know.  But it is the way the rules are written. 

If you start sending out text messages to kids suggesting they 'come play for Venice,' and you are not a representative of Venice's athletic interests, no one gets into trouble.  Although you may lose a few friends in Lakeland.  

Can a kid who receives multiple text messages decide to selectively turn in certain teams, but not others?  Yes.  Does that happen?  Not in my experience.  To the contrary, kids/parents that have been a part of the shady underworld of high school recruiting/transferring tend to do whatever they can to stay quiet and under the radar for fear of getting caught in the punishment net. 

As I have said many times (not necessarily on this site), most kids who get contacted by other schools take it as a compliment.  It makes them (and their parents) feel good.  "Dang, look at all these other schools/coaches that want me/my son to come play for them.  That's pretty cool. They're nice guys; why should I turn them in?"  And if the kid or his parents are the ones reaching out to other schools to gauge any interest that other schools might have, well, those are going to be the last kids/parents to want to turn anyone in. 

With all due respect, it appears to me that you are trying to make the argument that the existing rules need to be changed.  That may be true.  But, as you have seen with NIL, once the camel gets his nose in the tent, the rest of the body is sure to follow.  Or you can go with the Pandora's Box analogy.   Either way, it'll get crazy. 

[FBGUY1989]

22 hours ago, THIS_IS_DILLARD said:

Actually I would because the grass isn’t always greener on the other side. My son turns 21 in sept & never did I think about having him at one of those private schools. 
 

sure they have the boosters & college connects. But I’m a firm believer as to what’s for you will be for you. & hard work pays off. 
 

you can step foot on dillard campus and be the best thing that came through there since Issac Bruce & the offers will be there. 
 

in todays society these kids don’t want to work for anything. It’s monkey see monkey do if a bunch of kids aka their friends are all teaming up to play for whatever the “IT” school is that year that’s where they go. 
 

where’s the loyalty ? Where’s the pride ? If you ask me getting a ring as a super team , means nothing compared to a team that got it from the mud & actually earned it from hard work. Even if it took a down freshmen & sophomore year to get better & achieve said goal. 

You right and I think coaching plays a part as well. You see Teddy Bridgewater is back at his high school Northwestern and they've gotten tons of transfers in