Florida HS Crowds

[WindsorCT]

I’m so tired of looking at highlights from big HS games from other states and the stands are twice as big as most of Florida schools and they are packed. Florida can’t fill the stands for anything. Never any atmosphere etc. What are we doing wrong?!? I know it’s not EVERY school. Niceville, the Mecca (on big games), Venice etc. Just seems like there is such little community feel anymore for alot of schools. Am I wrong or am I just “old manning” right now?

[Jullian]

14 minutes ago, WindsorCT said:

I’m so tired of looking at highlights from big HS games from other states and the stands are twice as big as most of Florida schools and they are packed. Florida can’t fill the stands for anything. Never any atmosphere etc. What are we doing wrong?!? I know it’s not EVERY school. Niceville, the Mecca (on big games), Venice etc. Just seems like there is such little community feel anymore for alot of schools. Am I wrong or am I just “old manning” right now?

Here’s a number of schools that do pack em in.  Games I’ve been this & last season: Delray Atlantic, Western, Cardinal Newman, Naples, Dillard, Chaminade, Lake Wales, South Broward, just off the top of my head. Some schools that don’t, depending on the opponent: Gibbons, Aquinas, AHP. Of course STA/AHP was jammed last Friday. 

[DarterBlue2]

There are some schools that have good attendance, but they are a minority. At least in the Orlando area. 

This is caused by a variety of factors:

1. The transitory nature of living in the area. 2. Competing things to do on a Friday night. 3. Believe it or not, affordability. Between parking and attendance you are looking at an average of $15. Believe it or not that blows budgets when the average worker makes about $15-17 per hour. 4. The fact that many working people need second and, in some cases, third jobs to meet the cost of living. That does not leave much time for high school events of any kind. 5. Although Florida produces more than its share of big time players that go on to success in college and in the professional ranks, it's not a "football state" in the way: Texas, Georgia, Alabama, etc. are.  

This translates to relatively poor attendance. Apopka, for one, realizing that its fan base, is generally, not affluent, does not charge for parking making attendance more affordable. Interestingly, the only other area school that follows this philosophy, as far as I am aware,  is Lake Mary high which has a totally different demographic. 

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

1 hour ago, WindsorCT said:

I’m so tired of looking at highlights from big HS games from other states and the stands are twice as big as most of Florida schools and they are packed. Florida can’t fill the stands for anything. Never any atmosphere etc. What are we doing wrong?!? I know it’s not EVERY school. Niceville, the Mecca (on big games), Venice etc. Just seems like there is such little community feel anymore for alot of schools. Am I wrong or am I just “old manning” right now?

I’ve made a post in regards to this a few months back. If you ask me the mid attendance comes from the lack of true community with schools down here.

with so many transfers going on there’s no real love for said. School. Back in the day our grandparents, parents, us , then our kids went to the same high school. There used to be to be pride to play for your home school. 
 

on top of that especially with historically black schools, most fans only show up when the team is doing really well. If they are average or below then so is the attendance, which is crazy. 
 

now & days there are more spectators, people that only come to meet friends & show off their outfit then it is for true support of the team. 

[MarkECannon]

Everyone’s points are valid.  IMO, except for the schools mentioned already, we don’t have a real football culture that translates into attendance to high school games.  A lot of people did not enjoy their high school days and can’t imagine going back for any reason.  There is the old tired excuse that in Florida there are so many things to do.  You also have to have an amount of dedication to work all week, get off work on Friday and do what it takes to go to a game that night.

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

45 minutes ago, MarkECannon said:

Everyone’s points are valid.  IMO, except for the schools mentioned already, we don’t have a real football culture that translates into attendance to high school games.  A lot of people did not enjoy their high school days and can’t imagine going back for any reason.  There is the old tired excuse that in Florida there are so many things to do.  You also have to have an amount of dedication to work all week, get off work on Friday and do what it takes to go to a game that night.

Facts. For example. When I was coming up all I knew was Dillard. My entire mother side went to Dillard. When I got to high school I went to Dillard, played for Dillard, graduated from Dillard. 
 

since I started in my first game for Dillard in 07 I have not missed a game home or away since then. So for the last 17 years. Every Friday night, Saturday night, or on rare occasions mon or Thursday nights I’ve been blessed there. Working 40+ hour work weeks, taking care of my grandmother whose in her last stage of Alzheimer’s, taking care of my son who was autistic. 

wether it was walking, catching the city bus, the train (when we played Boynton in Boynton back in 2016), or catching a ride (when we played pahokee in pahokee on a Monday night). I’ve been blessed to be able to make it to every game. 
 

and that’s because I love my my school through & through. Bad years & good years. I bleed blue & gray like a crazed maniac lol, and wouldn’t trade it for the world. 

[FBGUY1989]

1 hour ago, DILLARDBOYZ954 said:

Facts. For example. When I was coming up all I knew was Dillard. My entire mother side went to Dillard. When I got to high school I went to Dillard, played for Dillard, graduated from Dillard. 
 

since I started in my first game for Dillard in 07 I have not missed a game home or away since then. So for the last 17 years. Every Friday night, Saturday night, or on rare occasions mon or Thursday nights I’ve been blessed there. Working 40+ hour work weeks, taking care of my grandmother whose in her last stage of Alzheimer’s, taking care of my son who was autistic. 

wether it was walking, catching the city bus, the train (when we played Boynton in Boynton back in 2016), or catching a ride (when we played pahokee in pahokee on a Monday night). I’ve been blessed to be able to make it to every game. 
 

and that’s because I love my my school through & through. Bad years & good years. I bleed blue & gray like a crazed maniac lol, and wouldn’t trade it for the world. 

You are a true Panther and love Dillard high school no matter what. Dillard could go 0-10 and I guarantee you were at all 10. Cursing, fussing mad in all lol.

[FBGUY1989]

I can't speak for Broward but Miami people show up in big crowds depending on the match up. Example Central and Northwestern will sell out Traz Powell Stadium and they'll have to bring out bleachers for the marching bands. Now if it's Northwestern and Edison or Hialeah people are not going to come out. 

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

1 minute ago, FBGUY1989 said:

You are a true Panther and love Dillard high school no matter what. Dillard could go 0-10 and I guarantee you were at all 10. Cursing, fussing mad in all lol.

and shedding a few tears along the way cuz wtf the is really going on. Luckily in my 2+ decades as a panther I haven’t witness such atrocity. 
 

and there has only been 1 year maybe 2 out of all those years that Dillard hasn’t made the playoffs all together. But you most def right ima ride to the end of earth and back about my Dillard & I want smoke with anybody who try to go against em lol. 
 

and as true fans that’s how it suppose to be. But as more and more years go by and the generations continue to change we’re losing more and more of what we considered things to be. 

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

1 minute ago, FBGUY1989 said:

I can't speak for Broward but Miami people show up in big crowds depending on the match up. Example Central and Northwestern will sell out Traz Powell Stadium and they'll have to bring out bleachers for the marching bands. Now if it's Northwestern and Edison or Hialeah people are not going to come out. 

And that’s what I just spoke on in my earlier comment. It’s sad that it is like that. 
 

if you LOVE your school fill those stands up wether it’s a big matchup or small one. Just because the hype level changes per opponent doesn’t mean the kids do. Those same kids are on the field & need/deserve the support. 
 

a lot of these kids don’t get any encouragement, cheers, congratulations & etc At home. & you’ll be surprised how a standing room only crowd there to support you and your team can do for a person, there moral, there confidence & also their mental. 
 

as big as the crowds are for Miami central & the west when both teams are good, those same crowds for those schools are piss poor for all the other “REGULAR” matchups. 
 

the kids, these programs , need us filling the stands every game. Just like we want the team and the coaching staff to give their all every game, we need to give our full support every game day. 
 

now granted things happen, and every single relative May can’t make it. But even then a few people missing on a specific Friday shouldn’t have the stands less then 60% or dare say less then 50% full. That’s what you call wishy wash half ass support. 

[PinellasFB]

It's pretty simple.  Where there is a sense of community, the team represents the community and gets big support.  All of those schools out of state that you see the big crowds, nearly all of those teams are part of a community identity.  FL is quite a bit different in this area due to many factors including transitory population (huge factor) and too many schools densely packed into a region.  There are a few communities that have an identity with the team in FL and they come out big time. I grew up in Punta Gorda and Charlotte HS still gets great support to this day.  A lot of people seem to stay in Punta Gorda too for some reason so a lot of players for CHS had parents who also went to CHS.  Compare that to my son's school Palm Harbor University HS and nobody's parents grew up in Palm Harbor. We actually get strong support from the community though because Palm Harbor does have a sense of community compared to other suburbs in Tampa Bay.

[WindsorCT]

35 minutes ago, PinellasFB said:

It's pretty simple.  Where there is a sense of community, the team represents the community and gets big support.  All of those schools out of state that you see the big crowds, nearly all of those teams are part of a community identity.  FL is quite a bit different in this area due to many factors including transitory population (huge factor) and too many schools densely packed into a region.  There are a few communities that have an identity with the team in FL and they come out big time. I grew up in Punta Gorda and Charlotte HS still gets great support to this day.  A lot of people seem to stay in Punta Gorda too for some reason so a lot of players for CHS had parents who also went to CHS.  Compare that to my son's school Palm Harbor University HS and nobody's parents grew up in Palm Harbor. We actually get strong support from the community though because Palm Harbor does have a sense of community compared to other suburbs in Tampa Bay.

Fair enough. All valid points from everyone. Definitely seems to be a Florida specific issue due to the transitory people. Being a Tampa Bay person, one of the things I’ll never forget is that loaded Tampa Jefferson team in 2011. Went 15-0, blew out Norland in the championship game. They hosted throughout the playoffs and never got more than 500 people. It was actually quite sad for the kids. 

[WindsorCT]

Another example of Pasco high. Truly one of those old school communities of Dade City. When they were rolling in the mid 2000’s-2015ish playoff games and the 9-mile War, the stands were filled. And it was an old school concrete stadium. Probably could fit a few thousand people. The town would empty out on Friday nights. Then they built Wiregrass and Cypress Creek. Killed their talent and split the zones between 5 schools. It killed the program. 
wiregrass, Wesley Chapel, Cypress, ZHills, and Pasco all drawing from the same area. 

[nolebull813]

In 1998 over 46,000 people packed the Orange Bowl to watch Miami Northwestern play Jackson in a regular season game!!!

https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=990847859502890&id=100057330555693

 

[THAT S--T WAS FUNNY]

Stadiums would be packed if at least 10% of students showed up and every parent/guardian of a football player, band member and cheerleader showed up. Then throw in loyal fans and you have a packed stadium. Sorry im just dreaming.

[FBGUY1989]

10 hours ago, PinellasFB said:

It's pretty simple.  Where there is a sense of community, the team represents the community and gets big support.  All of those schools out of state that you see the big crowds, nearly all of those teams are part of a community identity.  FL is quite a bit different in this area due to many factors including transitory population (huge factor) and too many schools densely packed into a region.  There are a few communities that have an identity with the team in FL and they come out big time. I grew up in Punta Gorda and Charlotte HS still gets great support to this day.  A lot of people seem to stay in Punta Gorda too for some reason so a lot of players for CHS had parents who also went to CHS.  Compare that to my son's school Palm Harbor University HS and nobody's parents grew up in Palm Harbor. We actually get strong support from the community though because Palm Harbor does have a sense of community compared to other suburbs in Tampa Bay.

Miami Northwestern Senior High School is the same. Northwestern is an historically black high since its existence in 1955. Being said you have at least 4 to 5 generations that are bulls which would explain why they have a good alumni and community support. I can't speak for others but when Northwestern play Central it's standing room only and when it's not Central there side is usually 60% full.

[FBGUY1989]

54 minutes ago, THAT S--T WAS FUNNY said:

Stadiums would be packed if at least 10% of students showed up and every parent/guardian of a football player, band member and cheerleader showed up. Then throw in loyal fans and you have a packed stadium. Sorry im just dreaming.

So true.

[FBGUY1989]

3 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

In 1998 over 46,000 people packed the Orange Bowl to watch Miami Northwestern play Jackson in a regular season game!!!

https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=990847859502890&id=100057330555693

 

This will never happen again in Miami. The Soul Bowl days are over. 

[Longtime Observer]

A way to fix the issue is to attach the programs to COMMUNITIES rather than SCHOOLS. The stakes (NIL money; college scholarships; publicity) are far too high for all of this to be treated and governed as if it's a mere "extracurricular" activity. Schools can still offer those, but they should get out of the big business that is prep football. I don't feel like typing more at the moment, but consider the above food for thought.

[FBGUY1989]

1 hour ago, Longtime Observer said:

A way to fix the issue is to attach the programs to COMMUNITIES rather than SCHOOLS. The stakes (NIL money; college scholarships; publicity) are far too high for all of this to be treated and governed as if it's a mere "extracurricular" activity. Schools can still offer those, but they should get out of the big business that is prep football. I don't feel like typing more at the moment, but consider the above food for thought.

Does Lakeland bring big crowds.

[nolebull813]

4 hours ago, FBGUY1989 said:

Miami Northwestern Senior High School is the same. Northwestern is an historically black high since its existence in 1955. Being said you have at least 4 to 5 generations that are bulls which would explain why they have a good alumni and community support. I can't speak for others but when Northwestern play Central it's standing room only and when it's not Central there side is usually 60% full.

Is Central a bigger rival than Jackson? I know competitively they are but who does the alumni hate more? Lol 

[Jullian]

10 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

In 1998 over 46,000 people packed the Orange Bowl to watch Miami Northwestern play Jackson in a regular season game!!!

https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=990847859502890&id=100057330555693

 

I was there. In 40+ years of watching HSFB in Florida, nothing comes close. On top of that the game lived up to the incredible hype! 

[DILLARDBOYZ954]

7 hours ago, nolebull813 said:

Is Central a bigger rival than Jackson? I know competitively they are but who does the alumni hate more? Lol 

When the competitiveness of the rival game becomes 1 sided that’s when the rival overall loses steam and spark. 
 

so in regards to tradition Jackson & MNW will always have that intense hate. 
 

but lately MNW & Miami central has both been very good in this neighborhood rival so that’s what’s most intense right now.

but again it’s only intense because both teams are good. 
 

if either team is down, the trash talking will be down & the attendance for that game will be down. 

[DarterBlue2]

10 hours ago, FBGUY1989 said:

Does Lakeland bring big crowds.

For their home games, yes. Unfortunately, when they travel outside of Polk County, they don't travel that well. 

[Dr. D]

15 hours ago, Longtime Observer said:

A way to fix the issue is to attach the programs to COMMUNITIES rather than SCHOOLS. The stakes (NIL money; college scholarships; publicity) are far too high for all of this to be treated and governed as if it's a mere "extracurricular" activity. Schools can still offer those, but they should get out of the big business that is prep football. I don't feel like typing more at the moment but consider the above food for thought.

So what you seem to be proposing is a community "all-star" team where all the best kids from all schools in the area would play.  In other words, turning high school football into AAU basketball.  And who attends AAU basketball games?  Parents, scouts, agents, and hangers-on.  Your approach might improve the "business" aspects of the sport, but I fail to see how it would address the issue at hand -- attendance and community support.  If anything, it would worsen these factors, as fewer people would support a team, attend games, or buy an ad in the game program if they have even less emotional attachment than they have now.  Not to even consider the logistical nightmare of transporting players from various schools 4-5 days a week.  While we can agree what we have now isn't working for the majority of teams, I'm not sure this suggestion is the way to go.  But again, we definitely need some creative/different approaches to the sport as it stands now, or we will not have a sport to support in 10-20 years.